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DHA with choline supplementation raises IQ 20 points This product is a probiotic fluid given to perinatal persons that causes their GI tract flora to make DHA as well as choline
well first you have to visit the graph I extended then decide if doing such a thing to a graph passes your filters
The
linked article notes that about half the IQ gain from breastfeeding comes from DHA Basically having the baby GI tract produce DHA over two years gives about 10 points a year
This is bolstered with the production of choline which is published as causing a 7 unit (units not specified) gain on part of the memory test known as WMS among those not eating food but getting TPN which is wildly different than, yet slightly similar to breastfeeding as its a one fluid provides all nutrients effect Note if you read the fine print the adult WAIS IQ test was not affected from choline
Choline supplementation during pregancy does cause lab mammals to have babies that grow up to have better cognitive processing than their peers Thus the human study of choline supplementation during pregnancy on IQ is of value
Anyway you genetically engineer the bacteria to make the DHA as well as choline then verify that it is absorbed
technology: yeasty dough will colonize a GI tract yet infants prefer fluids from a developing word perspective engineered e coli rich woodglue particles as a flavored colloidal fluid should get to the GI tract
Just one sip once n baby gets 20 plus more IQ points during their lifetime which is of tremendous value to the developing world as well as the global economy as clever people earn more plus earning more at the developing world benefits the environment
carotenes could be placed at the gene transfer plasmid such that if the nfants poop was colorized then the parents would know the nfant was also getting DHA plus choline As a kind of village medicine colorized poop could be used to reliably regrow inoculant cultures with active chemicals
the graph
http://i25.tinypic.com/umnvq.jpg
[beanangel, Jul 15 2009]
Journal article
http://www3.intersc.../119921904/PDFSTART
[beanangel, Jul 15 2009]
"Ask your doctor if galactagogue is right for you"
http://www.kellymom...l_galactagogue.html
[normzone, Jul 16 2009]
Transgenic DHA published
http://www.ncbi.nlm...nel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
These mice were genetically modified to produce more DHA Modifying mammals to produce a chemical is traditionally more effortful than engineering bacteria Thus I think GI tract flora that make DHA is a rapidly achievable technology [beanangel, Jul 20 2009]
Transgenic Fish make more DHA
http://www.ncbi.nlm...nel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
[beanangel, Jul 20 2009]
Trangenic plants make more DHA
http://www.ncbi.nlm...nel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
we reconstituted the DHA biosynthetic pathway in plant seeds, demonstrating the practical feasibility of large-scale production of this important omega-3 fatty acid in oilseed crops. [beanangel, Jul 20 2009]
Transgenic e coli make DHA
http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/73/3/665
E coli make DHA [beanangel, Jul 20 2009]
[link]
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You lost your chances of getting a bun from me with this comment: |
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//Anyway you genetically engineer the bacteria to make the DHA as well as choline// |
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[Marked-for-Deletion] Magic, or Bad Science, or Both. |
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By the way, that second link is bullshit. It says I have to pay for access to the article, and even then I only get 24-hr access. I'm not paying for access to your evidence. Find another link. |
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Wow, I knew the author by the title alone. |
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Count me into the title-author-clairvoyant group. |
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About the idea: Feeding toddlers GM organisms that actually do something to their biochemistry... would need to be extremely well proven-to-be-safe. |
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What's wrong with just good nutrition during pregnancy and lactation? Loads of nettle soup and tea would do the job, wouldn't they? Nettle's a galactagogue anyway. |
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if umbilical cord feeds into the stomach why not do it prenatally ? |
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You can't raise *everybody's* IQ anyway, since the norm is always 100 by definition. |
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The other thing is, what does IQ measure anyway? |
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What English Bob said. [marked-for-deletion] bad science. |
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Concerning the link, [normzone], i generally agree with La Leche, but what if you're a bloke?
Most of them have volatile components, but not nettle, meaning they don't come out in the milk or influence the baby. More relevant to this discussion is whether the choline comes out in the milk. |
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//This is bolstered with the production of choline which is published as causing a 7 unit (units not specified) gain on part of the memory test known as WMS among those not eating food but getting TPN which is wildly different than, yet slightly similar to breastfeeding as its a one fluid provides all nutrients effect//
Was this translated from Chinese? |
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Without epsilons who will run the elevators? |
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The meaning of the English translation is wildly different than, yet slightly similar to the original Chinese text. |
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For [beanangel] this idea is a "standard deviation". |
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there are now links to scientific papers that engineer DHA to be produced at mammals plants fish as well as e coli I think the techology is there
I say we maintain this idea |
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IQ Iq is measured against a base of referenced published validation studies rather than being a running average of a tested group Thus the average IQ of babies born after 1999 might be different than an average of babies born after 1920 |
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variations on why not just have people get nutrition right: The Davis University Alumni magazine says near 45 pt of wealthy people use multivitamins while 22 pt of the poor use them; I think the FDA says only a person per twelve gets their USRDI from food More than a billion persons had clinical nutritional deficiencies worldwide during the 20th century |
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If everyone is 20 IQ points or higher cleverer then all of the various things people do will be done at a slightly higher level. I have read that near the 20th century the average IQ of college grads is near 120 Thus a sip of this product everyone on earth is likely about as clever as a typical group of professional coworkers (I am now imagining Douglas Adams turning a whiter shade of pale) or to put it rather rather trickily, every developing worlder is as clever as the current peace corps people that visit to improve their society |
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Meanwhile the average college grad becomes about as clever as Obama People like Obama start thinking like Feynman on a near equal basis, People like Feynman then natually advance to the creation of .5b croissants with tetrachromo neon tetra dynamics but the Knuth notation really could use more cleverness |
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Pleasantly these cleverer people bring growth to the global economy right at the middle where it brings the greatest humanitarian benefit. I have read that people with some college or college grads earn more I have also read that each dollar spent on California higher education provides $4 of benefit simply giving people a sip of something once that improves their economic productivity anywhere from near 30 pt to double their pre sip output supports global prosperity This is of great value to export nations. |
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It isn't just about good nutrition though. If this worked, you would still need a nurturing environment, and that would be difficult to provide given that the preceding generation had no such advantages. Children labelled as gifted are often underachievers, and i can imagine something like this producing a new Generation X, only worse (as a Gen X-er, i'm allowed to say that). |
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actually the numbers go with the chemical effect About half of the breastfeeding IQ bonus comes from DHA about half from different factors |
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If I just used the IQ breastfeeding numbers it would be 40 points of IQ gain |
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Its aimed at the 19 out of 20 people that are born outside the US n UK They get cleverer which makes their lives better They think of amusing ways to earn money a $2k per person annual earnings raise is 14 Trillion dollars of economic power a year equivalent to the 1999 US economy |
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Export nations like Japan USA China have another entire United States sized export opportunity while the manufactured goods go to the economic environmental middle the place where they bring the greatest value for the resources used |
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or you could simply encourage mothers to breast feed their babies and provide the nursing mothers with proper nutrition. |
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//Nettle's a galactagogue anyway.// Yup!, Its chemical formula is H2G2 as well.
Honestly Chaps and Chapettes!, Hie thee to a debating society - [daseva] called it for bad science and it is also bad economics ! You are assuming that clever people make all the decisions and advances; there will be some profiteering bastards who will take the sip and the money in any case!. |
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Re the link, I was just seeking to see what a galactagogue was. I figured maybe it was a house of worship for galaxies. |
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So the baby would know when it's being breast fed? |
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OK, here we are not on Overbaked as usual.
Intelligence. Suppose it exists and there's a sudden jump in it. That won't help anyone. It'll just create existential angst everywhere and a generation of people who think life's pointless and can't integrate into society. Just boosting intelligence isn't enough. There needs to be a support network of people who can help them.
James Watson famously commented on what he saw as the lower intelligence of Sub-Saharan Africans. Whereas this is a tabu subject and i disagree with him, it wouldn't be surprising if poor nutrition in that region led to lower intelligence, if intelligence can be measured. Just doing something (don't know what) to improve nutrition generally would make a difference. Fatty acids are just one thing. They would help, but so would the likes of tryptophan, magnesium, folic acid, whatever. |
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Malnutrition:bad. Malnourished babies: Bad. Intelligence: Good (by definition) Colonialist presumptions:Bad |
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Then again, the people concerned, who are considered less intelligent, may simply be less Westernised. |
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Its eugenics innit? Only with DHA an all in your space an all like, innit? |
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//There needs to be a support network of people who can help them.// |
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Like lawyers and psychotherapists ? |
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Psychotherapists, psychodynamic ones anyway, seem to expect you to leave the non-emotional part of your personality behind and create a purely emotional persona when you go to see them, then shoehorn everything you say into their pet theories. I say that as someone who has been at both ends of therapy. Concerning lawyers, depending on the scope of what one regards as intelligence, that sounds like more of a career opening for the people concerned than a support network for them. |
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No, what i mean is that if you're supposedly a genius, how are you supposed to get an education or integrate into society if no-one can think on your level? You would be unlikely to get what you need, and as often seems to happen if you want to play the game of believing in intellectual giftedness, it takes so long for something intellectually challenging to come along that you get too used to the idea of things being easy and get lazy. If this plan worked, the result would be a whole generation of people who behave like this unless you've seriously ramped up the "intelligence" of the previous generation. That's what i mean by Generation X: a disaffected generation which is less productive than its predecessor and whose educational level is much higher than its occupation requires. I don't think that's desirable. Other things need to be sorted before this would be viable, even if it's technologically doable. |
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Perhaps people could sneak in some con-biotic on their neighbor's babies in order to give their own baby the competitive edge in the shaped-peg-in-hole game during play time competition. |
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//even if it's technologically doable// |
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History has shown this results in people working minimum wage to move muscles according to a script. Stitch 1, Seam 2, flip burger after 30 seconds, bing ! fries done. Have a nice day ! |
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As for the idea, probably a greater benefit to mankind is to enforce a 4 day working week. Thereby encouraging efficiency and leaving enough quality time with children. Or increase the minimum wage i.e. enhance the cultural vector rather than the competitiveness vector. [-] |
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The result might be superintelligent burger flippers then?
You make me wonder (inadvertently or not i don't know yet) if underachievement is something to aspire to. Less responsibility, work which is intellectually undemanding and mental freedom while you wait for the end of your shift. Interesting. |
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I haven't been on overbaked in years. I'm wondering if another, more modern venue would be good. |
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Did people go on there before? I don't think it's ever been popular.
Maybe one of those forum board places? I still think it's a bit of a hiding to nothing. |
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The way it works is: if everybody gets their IQ raised by 20 points, nobody does. |
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I've never been to overbaked. |
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People do, occasionally. It's been five months since the last post, which was of course mine. I think everyone's on Multiply. |
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//I think everyone's on Multiply// |
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