h a l f b a k e r yTempus fudge-it.
add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, best, random
news, help, about, links, report a problem
browse anonymously,
or get an account
and write.
register,
|
|
|
I know this is the same thing as my other idea- this is just a re-hashing so that everyone understands it. So...
I really hate having to go to 5 different stores to find the right rechargeable batteries for my devices that use Li-ion batteries. Also, the device manufacturer usually ramps up the price
of the batteries to pad their wallet. I know they usually last 2 to 4 years before a lot of capacity is lost, but when it does happen, it's a pain to find the right one. If there isn't a Batteries Plus store in your area, you might have to go online to find the right batteries.
Well, why not just have a BATTERY company (like energizer, duracell, etc.) make a small, rectangular li-ion battery pack for those smaller devices that are too small to take AA/AAA batteries? The reason it should be li-ion is because of energy density- you can squeeze more power into a smaller space. and, they're square and skinny, allowing it to be used in smaller devices.
It doesn't matter about all the crap with li-ion batteries needing to be charged at a certain voltage, because all devices set up to take these batteries, and all external chargers for them, would have the protective circuits.
The battery would be the size which you would find in a small MP3 player, like an Ipod nano. for bigger devices that need more power, like cell phones or portable game consoles, you could put more than one of these into the device, like putting 2 or 4 AAA batteries in an AAA battery powered device.
The batteries should be pre-charged when packaged, so that if your batteries run out while your taking pictures, you can buy more and just pop them in and keep shooting, just like the good-old AA/AAA batteries. Li-ion batteries have very little self discharge as compared with other rechargeable batteries, so that shouldn't be a problem.
Due to the fact that the battery is compatible with a majority of devices rather than being designed to fit a particular system, and it's thus not being made by the device manufacturer, it would likely not be as expensive as non-standard, device specific batteries.
There should be an external charger for these that charges the battteries without a device (like AA rechargeable batteries, and some cameras do this too) so that you won't need a seperate charging cord for every device you own.
Like I said before, devices that needed more power could take more of these- for example..
Mp3 player- 1 battery
Camera- 1 or 2 batteries
Cell phone- 2 batteries
Laptop computer- 6 batteries
Portable game console- 2 or 4, again depending on power requirements
(I'm just guessing here based on how much power these things draw)
So there you have it- a good alternative to expensive, hard-to-find, device-specific batteries.
http://gizmodo.com/...one-battery-for-all
This is basically what I'm getting at. (well not exactly this but it's kind of like that) [Dickcheney6, Aug 31 2008]
[link]
|
| |
The reason why there are any expensive hard to find batteries is that companies like charging a premium for device specific parts. I just don't think that large conventional manufacturers are going to make their products compatible with cheaper batteries simply because the high cost of repair is one reason you might choose to replace your gizmo2500 with the new razrgizmo3000 with touchscreen. |
|
| |
So you've boned this idea solely because the batteries would be cheaper/easier to replace??? |
|
| |
BTW that other link was deleted because it's completely off-topic to this idea. |
|
| |
What, do you work for a camera manufacturer? That's like saying "game consoles should not include a game in the box because it would be ready to play right when you bought it" |
|
| |
I don't see any other disadvantage here. most devices that use LI-ION batteries already have them easily removable- finding the right batteries is the hard part. so your high cost of "repair" is a moot point. |
|
| |
There are still plenty of devices made that take AA/AAA batteries- but the majority of consumers want small, sleek devices. AA, and even AAA battery powered devices often don't meet this need (but in fact some AAA devices do after all) and these devices rarely include rechargeable AAA batteries-so people who don't have them, end up having to keep buying batteries. Rechargeable AAA batteries are cheaper than rechargeable Li-ion batteries, but not everyone has them. So if the devices that used these new universal Li-ion batteries came with them, and whatever was needed to charge them, that'd be a great way to "spread them out" and no-one will really care because the device would still be compact like current Li-ion battery-powered devices. |
|
| |
Camera manufacturers, and some makers of MP3 players, often offer 1 model that takes AA or AAA batteries, then another that takes Li-ion batteries, which is smaller than the AA powered equivalent. Those companies give the consumer a choice based on their tastes-but often the Li-ion powered device wins out because it's smaller and thus looks cooler- but if there were a standard for li-ion batteries, then the MFRs who cared more about consumer satisfaction than about their profits (like kodak, they make AA battery cameras AND li-ion powered cameras) would simply use this standard battery. |
|
| |
If the device MFR wanted to pad their wallet, they could simply make the battery difficult to replace yourself- like an Ipod and some cell phones are today, and then charge a lot of money to replace the batteries at a service center- but since there would no longer be the "small/sleek" advantage of using specific batteries, few people would buy it and the product would likely be the biggest flop in the company's history. |
|
| |
So, the battery companies should just "pitch in" and make a small, sleek battery pack, and inform all major device manufacturers about the new battery design. |
|
| |
This would give the MFR 2 choices. |
|
| |
1. Use this standard battery, and make a small sleek device that looks cool and draws more customers due to the convinence of having a standard battery AND the wow-factor of a small, sleek device |
|
| |
2. use a specific battery, and make an equally small, sleek device that looks cool because it's small, and charge a premium for battery replacement-but then end up losing customers and getting a bad reputation for using a difficult to replace battery for the sole purpose of padding your wallet. |
|
| |
I boned this idea for the same reason I boned its previous iteration: it's a wibni. Besides, the battery that fits in today's device won't necessarily fit in tomorrow's. |
|
| |
I've seen this idea on the Dutch version of Dragons Den, I think. |
|
| |
One universal battery that can be bought everywhere and can be returned everywhere and recharged everywhere. |
|
| |
The investors obviously shot the idea down, because you can never convince manufacturers to produce for this globally standardized battery. |
|
| |
Manufacturers design products and batteries that are intended not to last, and that are a unique match so that you have to buy new stuff each time one part breaks down. It's what keeps their business going. |
|
| |
So unless you make both the batteries and clones of all existing gadgets yourself, the idea is unfeasible, I think. |
|
| |
For the moment, I'm postponing croissants/fishbones, because the idea in itself is obviously something we should be doing - but its practical implementation is so difficult. |
|
| |
//Manufacturers design products and batteries that are intended not to last, and that are a unique match so that you have to buy new stuff each time one part breaks down. It's what keeps their business going.// |
|
| |
Yeah right. look at nintendo- they build their products to last, and the Wii has out-sold everything else. look at all the bad press that the Xbox 360 has gotten with all the RROD and failing disk drives, scratching disks and such. That's exactly WHY I bought a Wii. You're basically implying that people are MORE likely to buy something that's poorly built than they are to buy something that's made well? I find that hard to believe. I know that when a product is first released, people dont know about durability/availability/price of accessories, but sooner or later the stories spread, and people who didn't buy it immediatly will know if it's a good product to buy. |
|
| |
Standardization worked with AA and AAA batteries, USB, SD cards, the list goes on and on. If this were actually made, the companies who continued to use a non-standard battery would look like crap, because it wouldn't be a form vs function debate anymore, considering that the standard battery would STILL have the form factor needed to make a smaller device. Devices that needed more power, could accept these in a series. there wouldn't be all the empty space that there would be with AAA batteries. The device MFR would STILL be able to stay in business from the profits of the actual device itself. |
|
| |
Rechargeable batteries have a limited lifespan reguardless of who makes them. Li-ion batteries are NOT any better in department than NIMH batteries- most rechargeable batteries, NIMH or LI-ION, last about 4 years if taken care of. I've had a camera battery last about 4 years before a lot of capacity was lost. I don't know what kind of battery it was, but I think it was a Li-ion battery. |
|
| |
It's the number of "charge cycles" that the battery can take. the more often it's recharged/used, the faster capacity will be lost. They tend to hold a reasonable capacity for about 500 charge cycles, after that they lose their ability to hold a charge for a lot of time. It does vary slightly depending on how it's used, and how the battery is built, but with normal use you can expect anywhere from 2 to 4 years of operating life from most rechargeable batteries of today-but when they DO need to be replaced, Li-ion batteries are expensive. |
|
| |
Granted, the Li-ion batteries would likely be around $15-20 for a 4 pack, so it'd still be more expensive than rechargeable AA/AAA batteries, but considering it's standard and not something specific to the device, it'd be cheaper. I mean, most rechargeable LI-ion batteries made to fit a particular phone or whatever often cost $30 to $50! laptop batteries are even worse- you can expect to pay *OVER $100* TO GET THEM REPLACED!!! |
|
| |
//unless you make both the batteries and clones of all existing gadgets yourself, the idea is unfeasible, I think.// so you just immediatly shoot this idea down just because it's about standardising something in electronics? you are basically implying that any type of standard anything is in principle, not possible to implement. not true at all. There are still companies who make devices that use AA and AAA batteries and those companies are still alive and well. It's not like this would have to spread across the world overnight in order to work. |
|
| |
Any device that uses these batteries would come with them. so I don't think there'd be any problem with getting the whole thing started, especially considering how rechargeable batteries usually last 2 to 4 years before they bite the dust. by then there would be enough stores carrying these batteries that you shouldn't have much trouble finding them. Remember, batteries are only a fraction of the company's profit. They would still make money from the device itself. The battery pack is just a way for them to get fatter profits. I tend to avoid devices that use Li-ion batteries whenever possible, with the exception of cell phones and laptops. |
|
| |
[Dickcheney6] imagine you are invited by a group of electronics goods manufacturers and battery manufacturers. You have 2 minutes to pitch your idea to them. |
|
| |
What would you tell them? How will you convince them that your idea brings bigger profits to them? |
|
| |
If you make a case, you get a standard halfbakery croissant :-) |
|
| |
The BATTERY companies would make more money from this. Not all device MFRs are going to take this, I understand, but using a standard, easy-to-find, low-cost rechargeable battery=people who are sick of spending $50 on device specific batteries that are hard to find, people who would rather buy a device that uses cheaper, standard batteries, while still keeping the customers who want small sleek devices, because of the smaller form factor of this battery vs an AA or AAA battery. So the people like me who avoid devices with not-standard, device-specific battery packs, would want to buy the device that uses a standard battery. |
|
| |
[Dickcheney] I still don't buy your sales argument. See, the fact that people are 'sick' of buying the $50 batteries, as you say, but nonetheless buy the gadget and are thus forced to spend big money on batteries - is one of the key drivers of this industry. That's where battery producers make their profit. |
|
| |
But anyways, I'm giving you a croissant because I agree that from a consumer and especially environmental point of view, a standardized battery would lead to much less nuisance and waste. |
|
| |
But you do need a better marketeer to pitch your idea, though :-) |
|
| |
It might be better to have a small range of battery standards of different powers and capacities, or to wire them in parallel rather than in series when more than one is needed. Is is a Bad Thing to use in series batteries of different capacity, state of charge etc. since the battery that goes flat first will prevent the remaining charge in the other batteries from being used, and potentially be damaged by the forward current. |
|
| |
by "in a series" I didn't mean a "series circuit" I meant "next to each other in the same compartment" |
|
| |
There are still many products being made that take AA and AAA batteries. So, I don't see why this would be such a bad idea. Now, there'll always be SOME companies that use a specific battery with their device, even if there were a standard for a small, slim battery. |
|
| |
The biggest problem for consumers reguarding AA rechargeable batteries vs. using a device-specific battery is, the "special" batteries are skinnier than AA, and often even AAA batteries. AAA batteries don't provide as much power as AAs, which is why you rarely see them in cameras. But, AA batteries= a somewhat bulkier device, making it less popular among consumers. |
|
| |
On the other hand, a standard battery that's skinnier would mean this- People who have had to replace expensive rechargeable batteries in the past, and have had trouble finding the right battery, will see that this device uses this new battery that is standard, cheaper, while still maintaining the slim profile, will want to buy it. |
|
| |
I actually try to avoid devices that use specific, expensive, hard-to-find-the-right-kind batteries whenever possible- I am fine with phones and laptops using them, but I only will buy a camera or portable speakers if it uses AA or AAA batteries, for example. |
|
| |
Forget your conventional batteries, [dick]. MEMS are into a new class of micro-engine energized batteries powered by minuscule propane tank, all housed in a standard sized battery shell. They beat the conventional electrolyte batteries in almost all aspects. |
|
| |
does a miniature truck pull up to your cell-phone and miniature propane-guy hop out and refill it ? |
|
| |