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NLAD-D Landmine

Nonlethal area denial - directional
  [vote for,

I searched Google for non-lethal landmines... and found 3 types. One was a highly visible, above-ground multi-directional multishot taser mine with a motion sensor. Another was not very clear about the chemistry or release mechanism involved, but seemed to involve a chemical reaction that somehow incapacitates the person who steps on it. Another simply involved a strobe light and exploding dye pak. The Taser Mine seemed to be the one the military is leaning most heavily toward, but clearly has limitations on a battelefield, where a thick field jacket and body armor will prevent penetration of the tines, and lacks any physical stopping power. My idea is different from all of those. Here it is:

A field of tripwire-activated claymores and bouncing Bettys packed with rubber pellets. They pack enough of a wallop to knock an intruder or group of intruders flat on his/her back, but don't kill. They thus prevent infantry movement through a given area, without killing innocent civilians years later. Vehicle movement would be prevented with concrete blocks and steel posts.

Note: I'm well aware of the stigma associated with rubber bullets, due to the fact that many people have been killed by them. I also researched the issue, and those fatalities were caused by trauma from the large rubber slugs striking the head. Such trauma would not be inflicted by small rubber pellets, which spread out the impact and individually pack little punch.

21 Quest, Aug 17 2009

Rubber Bullets http://en.wikipedia.../wiki/Rubber_bullet
The well-known firearm equivalent of this idea. [DrWorm, Aug 17 2009]


       Reminds me of rubber bullets. Good idea, except that many vehicles wouldn't be stopped by concrete blocks/steel posts. [+]
DrWorm, Aug 17 2009

       [doc] google "dragonstooth": they stop vehicles.
FlyingToaster, Aug 17 2009

       The idea was inspired by stinger grenades, which are sometimes used to quell prison riots. They're basically concussion grenades that are packed with tiny rubber balls. As far as I know, nobody's ever been killed by one, but they sure pack one hell of a wallop.
21 Quest, Aug 17 2009

       First of all, this is sort of baked by airsoft and paintball claymores (and military training ones). Second, what is the point as usually the goal in combat is to kill people.
DIYMatt, Aug 17 2009

       Couple of things I'd like to point out, Matt. First, I very much doubt that airsoft and paintball claymores use potent enough explosives to knock someone down with enough force to be useful in an area-denial role. My idea is for mines with military- grade explosive force to propel the rubber pellets hard enough to knock the fuck out of an intruder without actually killing them. The idea is not to score points in a game, or even to inflict pain, but to create a physically impassible defensive array. Second, the point of area-denial weapons is to keep enemy forces out of an area. Killing is a secondary objective, and one which people all over the world, many of whom frequent the HB, object to vehemently. Currently, the military is devoting a lot of research to developing non-lethal mines. Google it, dude. You don't always have to kill to incapacitate an enemy, and why kill when there's no need?
21 Quest, Aug 17 2009

       [21] - so, am I supposed to see this as some sort of good thing? Rubber bullets have a track record of killing, and your grenade sounds like it would rack up it's share of blinding scores.

       I'm all for "technically" non-lethal, but please reassure me that I'm not supposed to score this as massively humanitarian.
normzone, Aug 17 2009

       Look, a weapon is a weapon, Norm. This isn't meant to be gentle, it's meant to be effective with as little force as possible. I've no illusions that they won't inflict injuries, but compared with the dismemberment, burns, blinding, and the many dangers of shrapnel (ie, causing internal bleeding, migrating inside the body and doing God knows how much delayed damage) inflicted by existing landmines, these would be a huge improvement.
21 Quest, Aug 17 2009

       Do they not make EMP mines to fry any electrical and communication systems while not frying personnel?   

       I'm pretty sure that this could be thwarted with the use of what is known as a "shield". They are pretty old tech and reasonably available to most "evil doers". Wouldn't you do better with a mix of sticky foam and long high strength fibers?
MisterQED, Aug 18 2009

       if the mine happened to detonate in front of you, the shield might help. As far as emp, that doesn't stop a trooper from advancing. And while rubber bullets have killed, research will show you that those fatalities were a result of trauma caused by a large rubber slug striking the head. Small rubber pellets would distribute the force over a greater area on the body, and none of them individually would cause much damage.
21 Quest, Aug 18 2009

       I once spoke to a weapons research scientist about baton rounds.
His comments went along these lines: "Squaddies don't want less-than-lethal. They want to know that when they fire, the other guy is going to stop being nasty to him as quickly as possible.
We had to modify the rounds to stop them removing the rubber bullet, and putting in a battery [C or D cell, can't remember], or embedding razor blades in the baton. Sort out the morals first, but always expect the squaddie to circumvent your higher intentions"
AbsintheWithoutLeave, Aug 18 2009

       "squaddies" don't lay minefields and if they're lucky they don't have to take them up, either; mind you this doesn't sound like a traditional minefield more of..err.. what the title says.
FlyingToaster, Aug 18 2009

       Absinthe, I don't give a rat's ass if the ground pounders don't want non-lethal weapons. It's not their choice what sort of mines are used, and the government (their boss) is looking for non- lethal mines right now, anyway. For one thing, they still have their guns, and number two, they don't have to clean them up later, as FT pointed out.
21 Quest, Aug 18 2009

       But does it deny area? I think it only works if you can respond to the noise of the mines going pop, and get some people to intercede. Otherwise you just get very bruised squaddies leaving the other side of the 'mine' field. As such it seems to be a partial solution (but its still an improvement on always having to blow people up)
RattyBunyip, Aug 19 2009

       Mine fields are most effective when closely monitored, anyway, in case a guy with a metal detector leads his squad through. Even the best mines aren't completely impassable. They just make it very slow going.
21 Quest, Aug 19 2009

       "Ask you doctor if NLAD-D is right for you".
normzone, Aug 19 2009

       I have just come up with another + point for this technology.
Sheep have nice thick woolly coats. Bear with me on this... Sheep are one of the most popular mine clearance devices out there, but they are even more ideal when their thick coats mean they don’t even get blown into little cutlet sized bits (or even badly bruised) every time they 'clear' a mine!
RattyBunyip, Aug 20 2009

       foam-rubber version marketed to Nerf?
CaptainClapper, Aug 24 2009

       /where a thick field jacket and body armor will prevent /

       On encountering the rubber bullet shooting bouncing betty and given the option, I would prefer the field jacket, helmet and visor over my gold lamé speedo and paisley body paint.
bungston, Aug 24 2009

       //hard enough to knock the fuck out of an intruder// idea written while overdosed with testosterone?

       anyways, the force of the blast will decrease with something between 1/r^2 and 1/r^3, therefore the corridor for 'non-lethal and effective' will be a rather narrow band bordered by 'lethal' and 'uneffective'.
loonquawl, Aug 25 2009

       which would be important if it were a concussive rather than a fragmenting munition.
FlyingToaster, Aug 25 2009

       as the fragments are really small, and could be said to be the surface of an expanding sphere, the energy delivered to a given area will decrease as 1/r^2, or similar...
loonquawl, Aug 25 2009


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