Half a croissant, on a plate, with a sign in front of it saying '50c'
h a l f b a k e r y
Faster than a stationary bullet.

idea: add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, random

meta: news, help, about, links, report a problem

account: browse anonymously, or get an account and write.

user:
pass:
register,


                     

Liquid hydrocarbons from Methane hydrate piezo mineral tumbler

while piezoceramic blobs sparkle against each other from the tumbler rotation they transform CH4 from methane hydrates to higher value possibly liquid hydrocarbons (plausibly referenced)
  (+2)
(+2)
  [vote for,
against]

This is a cool temperature, generatorless physical piezoelectric methane hydrate piezoelectric peening tumbler. Everytime the piezoceramic blobs sparkle against each other from the rotation they transform some of the CH4 or possibly CH4 H20 atmosphere at the peening tumbler with their over 1KV electrical sparks. Published material (link) notes the transformation of CH4 to other hydrocarbons at 1 Kilovolts to 100 Kilovolts, so current piezeoelectric ceramics are just adequate. Oceanic Methane hydrates are described as being 5 to 7 times more plentiful than coal.

Methane hydrates at the ocean suggest the possibility that the large amounts of natural mechanical motion of water could be used to provide mechanical effects to create piezoelectricity. If it actually works it is an ocean onsite cool reactor that produces higher value hydrocarbons from the earths most plentiful hydrocarbon.

Dielectric disintegration of CH4 creates a variety of hydrocarbons. One reference (link) notes that 4/10th of these are C5 hydrocarbons are higher. The thing though is producing higher hydrocarbons from CH4 very cheaply. One big research opportunity is that there are no easily found studies on dielectric disintegration of the actual methane clathrate crystal, describing its various reaction products. Also although an electric arc through anything causes chemical reactions, producing the electricity is only partially efficient, although a cogen like apparatus where process warmth that has value could cofunctionalize the electricity that transforms the methane hydrate. Thus the onsite cool piezo reactor that produces higher value hydrocarbons from the earths most plentiful hydrocarbon might be better.

Now its likely that current state of the art or better mineral grinders with piezoelectric surfaces as well as possibly witricity would have higher efficiency, its just pretty comprehrensible to have a mineral tumbler with piezo blobs at ch4s gas producing something thats rather like butane to hexane, with gunk), at least from (link) Also I read that during the 20th century about 4/5 the value of liquid natural gas (LNG) was from the transport as well as distribution. even just converting ch4 to a hydrocarbon that is liquid at waterice temperature would make these fuels three or four times cheaper than LNG.

I saw some graph that said that oceanic methane hydrates are like 5 or 7 times more plentiful than all of earths coal as well as oil reserves, thus creating new ways to convert CH4 to more highly valued things like liquid fuels or even just longer hydrocarbons is of value. (Technically, possibly quadrillions of US$14 trillion/yr, half a century of growing use, over a quadrillion US$) so if any of you have methane hydrate ideas, yum yum!

beanangel, May 01 2013

(?) Methane to higher value hydrocarbons with dielectric disintegration http://www.mendeley...arrier-disc/#page-1
Direct higher hydrocarbon formation from the greenhouse gases methane and carbon dioxide using a dielectric-barrier discharge [beanangel, May 01 2013]

1 or 2 kilovolts from piezoelectric materials http://www.physikin.../tutorial/4_10.html
[beanangel, May 01 2013]

images of some of the references http://www.liveleak...ew?i=234_1367375935
[beanangel, May 01 2013]

[link]






       yahbut...   

       n(CH4) -> m(CH2) ... wheres all the H go ?
FlyingToaster, May 01 2013
  

       // wheres all the H go //   

       You just put it in a fuel cell weather balloon of course.
scad mientist, May 01 2013
  

       Hydrogen bomb?
RayfordSteele, May 01 2013
  

       Hydrogen is a delicious ingredient refineries enjoy.
beanangel, May 01 2013
  

       One tiny little question: What's powering your tumbler?   

       One follow on: Is there any possible way in which the transition from that power source to mechanical motion to piezo electric generation, to long chain hydrocarbon production, is more efficient than using that power source directly?
MechE, May 02 2013
  

       [MechE] I perceive you are asking "is there a better way"   

       I think its all about localization. although oceanic motion has a moderate efficiency at moving things, then a part of that at making electriciy, the idea kind of suggests that ocean motion is more efficient because of local resources, than combusting ch4 to produce motion as well as electricity.   

       One novel thing about this idea is that it suggests the creation of new technologies that most effectively transmit ocean motion to another thing. That could be very different than wave surface energy. what if a polymer bag with piezo blobs contained ch4, then gradually rose to the surface, with a kitelike shape that caused tumbling on the way up? actually you could just modify ballasting electronically, then have it do as many cycles of ocean floor to surface as were preferred to convert the most efficient amount of ch4.   

       Or, what if combusting part of the gas to make very carefuly tuned thrummmmmm sounds at a gas turbine that optimize piezo response along with electrical generation is more efficient than wave energy?   

       or what if there are really awesome wave energy locations that also have methane hydrates, these could be valued areas to petrochemical company prospectors   

       or what if predictable thermal variations could cause a huge beam to shrink or grow a few cm, that then very powerfully gears a pressurization or motion effect   

       some of these have localization, financial or ecological advantages The giant polymer bags with piezocoated sides as well as interior crenellations that just bouyantly loop until they are full of hydrocarbons is kind of pretty If cristo made one then called it "energy mitochondria" it would be like science art that might also be production functional   

       a petrochemical engineer creating a bunch of nested vibrating pipes coated with piezomaterial then tuning that to vibrate from the travel of gas could give undersea mad scientists with huge pipe organs as well as vast wealth greater credibility.   

       there are a lot of variations
beanangel, May 03 2013
  

       No, what I was really asking is, where are you getting the power? Even if the answer is wave action, you'd do better with a large wave generator to generate electricity, then feed that directly to your methane system. Piezo generation is not especially efficient, and is rarely the best way to generate power.
MechE, May 03 2013
  
      
[annotate]
  


 

back: main index

business  computer  culture  fashion  food  halfbakery  home  other  product  public  science  sport  vehicle