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how much we don't know

Human atomic elemental weights against modeled molecules
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In theory, every atom in the human body could be accounted for.

Knowing the elemental composition and overall mass gives us amounts of each element. As we work out molecular models of the molecules of in the human body and their amounts, they can be ticked off the elemental stocktake. Crystalline and fabric materials such as bone and cell walls have to be modeled, quantified. Respiratory gases, although transitory should not be too much of a problem.

Gut fauna and biological interlopers would pose big accuracy deficiency. But continual research in these areas will keep supplying data.

If the count is done in a patchwork fashion, the only way it can be done, then areas that are not known, will have big discrepancies between modeled molecular numbers and elements weighed.

Stoichiometry is well and truly an rock solid tool in science but with supercomputer modeling and statistical analysis, can it be taken to a whole new level to show us where the unknowns are hiding.

wjt, Apr 09 2017

P prime prime https://en.wikipedi...P%E2%80%B2%E2%80%B2
the reference [Ian Tindale] attempted to make, which caused his cephalic and colonic content to blend & vent [lurch, Apr 16 2017]

[link]






       OK, so this is not about quantitative epistemology, but rather about ... um ...   

       Are your bathroom scales broken?
pertinax, Apr 09 2017
  

       Are you proposing to analyze the chemical composition of the human body solely by measuring its mass to extreme accuracy and precision?
notexactly, Apr 09 2017
  

       In patchwork, Yes. As a reference for all those molecular pathway models in the computer. Large mass discrepancy = something unknown, something to be investigated.
wjt, Apr 10 2017
  

       Ultimately all models are collectively communal, or so say the searching equational centric physicists.
wjt, Apr 10 2017
  

       //something unknown//   

       ... or possibly a doughnut.
pertinax, Apr 10 2017
  

       It'll be somebody's body but not everybody's body: like the genome project was just really one person's DNA wasn't it? and just a snapshot, I'm pretty sure my the atoms will have mostly moved on down the sewer within a few years and then been picked by an Albanian in a mushroom farm and sold to you wtj. Still, useful information to gather. I'd like to see where I end up
DDRopDeadly, Apr 13 2017
  

       //the genome project was just really one person's DNA wasn't it? // Actually it wasn't. The first "complete" (except it wasn't, really) human genome reference sequence was an amalgam of cloned fragments from multiple individuals.
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 13 2017
  

       Thanks for the correction MB.. I wonder if that amalgam person will ever be born
DDRopDeadly, Apr 14 2017
  

       Well, one person in 2^30000, roughly, should be that amalgam. Sadly that's -E- on my calculator.
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 14 2017
  

       You might like looking at all the chemicals at a spectroscopy plot. The height of each chemical, as well as the area under each chemical's "curve" speak to what you are asking.   

       Also, nuclear magnetic resonance imaging NMR (related to MRI) could be improved to detect more kinds of atoms more effectively.   

       Also, pragmatically, if you are willing to use rats or pigs as model experimental animals their individual organs can be connected to something like a heart-lung pumping and oxygenating and nutrient machine permitting ultra high resolution scanning of something the size of say a heart or a gland or a brain for elemental and molecular composition
beanangel, Apr 14 2017
  

       /'envelope' or 'convex hull'/ Made up of a collection of areas of focused interest.   

       [Max] Wouldn't the random stuff between genes mess with that calculation?
wjt, Apr 15 2017
  

       // The 'envelope' or 'convex hull'. That's what that'd be called. //   

       That would hide the valleys in the spectrogram, which are just as important as the peaks.
notexactly, Apr 15 2017
  

       // 2^30000 //   

       My computer was not willing to calculate that either, but Wolfram|Alpha was:   

       ~7.94*10^9030   

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588 754 339 376 178 603 572 206 993 104 116 724 005 865 677 519 296 398 159 948 715 473 178 534 023 839 748 776 968 930 959 359 430 050 467 682 338 953 460 003 719 728 316 579 187 691 878 697 698 768 262 029 532 555 154 453 385 626 292 655 405 747 586 784 964 721 828 435 123 748 874 036 892 336 467 993 833 313 566 351 099 012 062 133 708 330 659 839 945 835 334 408 003 540 883 710 466 685 587 003 017 166 599 283 017 074 947 301 584 414 988 865 004 786 028 293 285 499 770 491 180 405 306 064 801 835 537 732 617 278 174 051 627 839 185 610 787 636 744 236 037 208 733 359 089 934 980 863 639 140 305 262 357 999 304 049 578 253 805 867 435 072 383 872 118 239 392 509 532 576 937 965 747 681 037 411 189 244 456 427 767 218 969 226 659 923 736 338 685 936 365 229 374 852 506 760 977 484 949 718 096 704 779 139 202 025 385 886 007 539 531 005 659 537 317 072 283 913 313 695 763 253 184 409 898 181 120 428 466 758 352 325 450 311 576 982 995 045 335 286 929 880 973 682 790 673 015 037 574 198 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notexactly, Apr 15 2017
  

       // Wouldn't the random stuff between genes mess with that calculation?// No, it's all just DNA. That's why DNA is so fantastically cool - everything is just a bitstream. When you die of cancer, it's a bitstream. If you have your father's nose or your mother's beard, it's a bitstream. If you're not an elm, it's a bitstream. If you get Ebloa, it's a bitstream. DNA does for biology what computers do for photos, music, 3D models and pornography.
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 15 2017
  

       So have I got this right? On the transcripted strand each position has four posibilities so that 4 x 4 x 4 x 4 .. for however many base pairs there are in the Human genome. - the areas that have to be the same to make us human creatures + the available variance of those areas.All summing to 2 ^30000 approx.
wjt, Apr 15 2017
  

       //So have I got this right?// Not as such, alas. In fact, my 2^30000 was a vague sort of guesstimate, based on the assumption that haplotype blocks (chunks of human DNA that tend to remain intact during recombination across many generations) are about 100kb long, hence 30,000 of them in the genome; and suppose there are a couple of common haplotypes for each one.   

       Then again, I didn't reckon on the fact that humans are mostly diploid, so it's more than that.
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 16 2017
  

       [Ian] Do you have an under the sea, Jules Verne-ish problem with your computer?
wjt, Apr 16 2017
  

       [MaxwellB] Even two individuals with equal zygote DNA could be told apart by their pockets' of mutations as age takes hold on cell divisions. The body can't repair that perfectly, surely.   

       Then again, that is on the otherside of the zygote . My statement is two adult individuals can't have the exactly same makeup of DNA. Too much complexity.
wjt, Apr 16 2017
  

       I just realized that that great big number I posted the other day is odd, while claiming to be a power of two. It's also only 9029 digits long, not 9031 (according to: echo "[the number]" | sed "s/ //g" | wc). I think I would have noticed if I had dropped two at the end, given that I processed it with Python to add the spaces, and had to adjust my code to get the spaces in the right place relative to the end of the number. Therefore I blame W|A for giving me the wrong answer.
notexactly, Apr 17 2017
  

       //Even to zygote DNA equals could be told apart by their pockets of mutations as age takes hold on cell divisions. // I have very little idea what that sentence means but, yes. No two cells in your body have the same genome. The next revolution in genomics will appreciate this. The 50%+ of "genetic" disorders which don't appear to be inherited will come down to somatic variation. If you want an independent confirnation of this, I strongly suggest that you ask me again, when sober.   

       //two adult individuals can't have the exactly same makeup of DNA.// Well,yes, although I would subsitute "one" for "two".
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 17 2017
  

       A zygote base line DNA reading is almost needed to see changes. That or a multi-point DNA biopsy with a full sequencing.
wjt, Apr 18 2017
  

       At MaxCo, we are pioneering Whole Body Sequencing. With something like a kilo of DNA to start with, even Nanopore sequencing might give some useful data.
MaxwellBuchanan, Apr 18 2017
  

       The person gets up and walks away, right?
wjt, Apr 20 2017
  

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588 754 339 376 178 603 572 206 993 104 116 724 005 865 677 519 296 398 159 948 715 473 178 534 023 839 748 776 968 930 959 359 430 050 467 682 338 953 460 003 719 728 316 579 187 691 878 697 698 768 262 029 532 555 154 453 385 626 292 655 405 747 586 784 964 721 828 435 123 748 874 036 892 336 467 993 833 313 566 351 099 012 062 133 708 330 659 839 945 835 334 408 003 540 883 710 466 685 587 003 017 166 599 283 017 074 947 301 584 414 988 865 004 786 028 293 285 499 770 491 180 405 306 064 801 835 537 732 617 278 174 051 627 839 185 610 787 636 744 236 037 208 733 359 089 934 980 863 639 140 305 262 357 999 304 049 578 253 805 867 435 072 383 872 118 239 392 509 532 576 937 965 747 681 037 411 189 244 456 427 767 218 969 226 659 923 736 338 685 936 365 229 374 852 506 760 977 484 949 718 096 704 779 139 202 025 385 886 007 539 531 005 659 537 317 072 283 913 313 695 763 253 184 409 898 181 120 428 466 758 352 325 450 311 576 982 995 045 335 286 929 880 973 682 790 673 015 037 574 198 678 081 581 095 988 135 833 790 694 215 909   

       You quite sure about that 812?
not_morrison_rm, Apr 20 2017
  

       Where's Wally without a wally. I was disappointed.
wjt, Apr 20 2017
  
      
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