Half a croissant, on a plate, with a sign in front of it saying '50c'
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A Bakery Regulatory Body
  [vote for,

It's my first week in the HB, and the only quality I have in abundance is newness. In fact, I'm so new, I'm barely out of my shrink wrap. So I put this suggestion forward with all due respect to the long suffering (or existing) HBers.

I should say, I'm perfectly happy to concede that most, if not all, of my HB suggestions so far have received fishbones not because I was new to the HB, but because they were rubbish.

But it does beg the question, as a newbie: what if the bakery has slowly, over a period of time, decended into cronyism and corruption?

Doesn't it follow that, if you understand UnaBubba's philosophy, based on a series of ideas, that you'll be more sympathetic to whatever he suggests next, and croissant it? And if so, doesn't that undermine the principle of the bakery?

I'm not saying that croinyism exists, or is thriving within the bakery. However I'd ask each of you: if it exists, and you were near to it, would you notice it?

Maybe what you need is OFBAKE (like OFTEL, OFCOM, OFWAT etc) to occasionally examine an idea independently, and consider whether the bakery was scoring each idea fairly, hence adding credibility to each idea.

OK, this is another rubbish newbie idea, isn't it? I can feel you fishboning already. Bugger.

Fishrat, Sep 25 2003

A few suggestions for your next idea... http://krelnik.home...g.com/half_faq.html
Free of charge. [krelnik, Oct 04 2004, last modified Oct 05 2004]

Occasional newbie croissant! http://www.halfbake...22_20phone_20button
[Fishrat, Oct 04 2004, last modified Oct 05 2004]


       In answer to your last sentence, yes. Do you want to take a guess at how many times this argument has been put forth by grumbling ill-received new members in the past? After you do that, take another guess at how many times it's been proved incorrect by the arrival of the occasional newbie who scores croissant after croissant.   

       It's the ideas, stupid. Despite some occasional misses, Fishrat, you show great promise. Don't ruin it with crap like this
waugsqueke, Sep 25 2003

       It's not crap <reserves right to disagree with elders and betters>. It may be wrong , but it's a fair question. By the way, did you deliberately NOT fishbone this idea just to confuse me? That's perverse. ps Thanks for the nice bit...
Fishrat, Sep 25 2003

       Fishrat, check the link for a document that has been helpful to other newbies in the past. Also see the link within that document (the one that says "here is proof") for a view that will show you over 60 ideas that were written by newbies over the past year that did well in the voting. Let me know if it either is of help to you.
krelnik, Sep 25 2003

       Oh, so NOW you fishbone. I see.
Fishrat, Sep 25 2003

       Thanks, [krelnik]. Let's be clear: As I said initially, I'm not whining about the tragic life of a newbie. In fact, I've managed a couple of croissants myself over the past few days [link]. I'm trying to ask a sincere question from a viewpoint that you guys can no longer attain.   

       All too soon, I won't be a newbie. All too soon, I will be a part of this established community. Then, I won't be able to offer an outsider view.   

       Please accept my idea/question at that face value. I'm not whinging, threatening, or being deliberately obtuse. Promise.
Fishrat, Sep 25 2003

       Well, I've only been here a year, and I had similar questions when I first started. You can certainly dig around in the bakery and find ideas that seem to support the theory of cronyism. However, if you keep looking, you can also find a ton of ideas by newbies that shot out of the park vote-wise.   

       Follow the link I added, and click the link within that says "here is proof" and you'll see over 1 per week spread over the last year of the last type. It amply demonstrates that newbies can do well if you just hit the "sweet spot" of what constitutes a good idea. The rest of that document constitutes my advice on a good method to aim for that sweet spot.
krelnik, Sep 25 2003

       Thanks again, [krelnik]. I'll have a good read. Maybe my "Don't Worry" phone button will make it onto your "here is the proof" list at some point.
Fishrat, Sep 25 2003

       Sure, why not? Haven't added one in a while and you made it to 10 votes.
krelnik, Sep 25 2003

       //consider whether the bakery was scoring each idea fairly//

All votes are cast fairly because the only criteria involved is "'do I like this idea or not?". The reasons for your preference, whether that be because it makes you laugh, because it would make the world a better place or whether it's because your mate suggested it, are irrelevant.
DrBob, Sep 26 2003

       An idea's merit is also dependent on the spirit in which it is posted. For instance, Fishrat states: "Please accept my idea/question at that face value. I'm not whinging, threatening, or being deliberately obtuse. Promise." Therefore, Fishrat isn't caught, Fishrat-hamstrung, canned and sold on the black market. Also note how ill-received ideas are in this category. Scroll up, and observe the boneyard on the right. Obviously, you're doing something right.
thumbwax, Sep 26 2003

       [Fishrat] I understand what you are saying but the OFBAKE thing is definitely not the answer. The solution is obviously to convince one of the HB old skool to submit a 'flying car' idea that we can fishbone to oblivion. C'mon UnaBubba you know you want to.
nichpo, Sep 26 2003

       There are users that have gotten fishboned to obvlivion in the past simply because they didn't get it, nor wanted to, and so started behaving very badly, picking fights and whatnot. Then there are users who started out badly, but then would post something significantly improved, and the improvement factor would cause me to vote +, regardless of whether the idea was on par with the halfbakery standard or not, because I wanted to encourage that user in the right direction.   

       There's also an element of expectation for the long-term baker's submissions to hit something of their own average quality, and so it becomes tougher over time, especially as the unexplored idea territory becomes smaller.   

       Being a halfbaker is something like being a stand-up comic. You must read your audience, time the jokes, dance around the more difficult issues, and sometimes spin a few plates at the same time, all the time coming up with fresh material.
RayfordSteele, Sep 26 2003

       // It may be wrong , but it's a fair question. //   

       Perhaps, but it's one we get tired of being asked every couple of months.
waugsqueke, Sep 26 2003

       Sorta comes with the job, though, doesn't it, waugs? After all, a newbie doesn't know or care how many other billions we've served. They still deserve a smile.
RayfordSteele, Sep 26 2003

       Actually, I don't think there is that much cronyism here - mostly old HBers get mostly croissants cos they know what the audience wants (as Rayford says) and therefore post only those ideas they come up with that they think have a chance. They'll still get alot of bones if they put up a turkey.
A word from the wise(or at least the "been around here a while" anyway), [Fishrat] don't start this sort of "why is everyone picking on me" mularkey. You too could end up the next George the Robin (Don't ask). Suffice to say, you don't earn any brownie points hjere for feeling agrieved at the voting, and even fewer for complaining about it. Suggest you simply go and put your thinking cap on and come up with something brilliant! Good luck! If you want to see someone with a great hit ratio on good ideas (from a standing newbie start at that) I suggest you checkout the collected works of one FarmerJohn.
goff, Sep 26 2003

       Others to look at and emulate are [lostdog] and [AO]. Both joined in the last 8 months and both have racked up a quite impressive array of ideas in that time. That's one of the reasons the newbie view includes the user names, to encourage you to look at that person's other ideas.   

       It is equally important to take notice of those who get off to a slow start, but eventually post some real winners. A good example of that is [DeathNinja], who took a while to get the hang of it but has posted several double-bun ideas in the last month.
krelnik, Sep 26 2003

       and now for the weather:   

po, Sep 26 2003

       Where is Death, by the way? Out scything?
FarmerJohn, Sep 26 2003

       Enquiring mind sated. Neck wound in. Tail between legs. Cap universally dothed. Baker's cap on, thanks all for the advice...
Fishrat, Sep 27 2003

       Don't take it too seriously. If you show up here and fit in right away, you might be accused of being some senior 'baker's second/third, etc. account. No big deal either way. Carry on.
half, Sep 27 2003

       C Trebor: I think you'll find that's not so. I belong strictly to the lob-a-moldy-tomato-and-run-anarchist faction of the HB, and have no official capacity whatsoever.
DrCurry, Sep 28 2003

       I don't want to worry you [Alf], but my first posting did well, too. But hey, maybe you're just wiser than me, quicker. The bakery is, I guess, different things to different people at different times. Sometimes it feels like a competition to me. If it doesn't feel like a competition to you, that's good.

       What I was offering here was a different view of the bakery to everybody else, so it's understandable that it might get fishboned. From my new perspective as a no-longer-new half baker, I think much of what I've written here is nonsense. I'll fishbone it at once. The good thing is, the fish makes the croissant taste sweeter.
Fishrat, Oct 14 2003


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