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well, they've gone and done it

ignition
  (+3)
(+3)
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against]

well it's been just around the corner for 70 or so years, but it looks like it's at least peeking...

[marked-for-expiry]

theircompetitor, Dec 13 2022

US DOEenergy announcement https://www.energy....ing-fusion-ignition
[theircompetitor, Dec 13 2022]

What enabled the big boost in fusion energy announced this week? https://arstechnica...nnounced-this-week/
[a1, Dec 13 2022]

elsewhere ... https://xkcd.com/2710/
[pertinax, Dec 15 2022]

Everything's lasers with you! https://youtu.be/fv5RI6zpNTc
[21 Quest, Dec 15 2022]

Water splitting https://en.wikipedi...iki/Water_splitting
[a1, Dec 16 2022]

Sadly not mentioned in this handy resource B.O.O.K https://www.howtoinventeverything.com/
corollary to D. Adams' 'HHGuideTTGalaxy' [Sgt Teacup, Dec 18 2022]

[link]






       Have a short list of kitcheny ingredients all nicely fused together.
whatrock, Dec 13 2022
  

       What are they using to squeeze the thingies together for long enough? I mean, if this is true it's the biggest discover since the water filled workout suit.
doctorremulac3, Dec 13 2022
  

       lasers I think. everything is better with lasers
theircompetitor, Dec 13 2022
  

       Interesting, I had heard a lot about this target from the European people. I think its very important from a physics point of view as well as a cool point of view but I was disappointed as usual to see the usual line about "powering homes and businesses".
pocmloc, Dec 13 2022
  

       Unintended consequence of unlimited clean and cheap power: Humanity burns itself to a crisp when everyone has a few "clean" and “cheap”terawatts to play with instead of the smoky, tightly budgeted few kilowatts we each get now.   

       To stave that off, millions of unemployed mining sector employees can go to work on the low earth orbit sun shade project.
a1, Dec 13 2022
  

       //lasers I think. everything is better with lasers//   

       We've had lasers for decades though, what's causing the net gain?   

       They incorporated the water filled exercise suits didn't they. They finally figured it out. Better physical health, better mental health, somebody with enhanced brainular activity said "Hey, what if we try pushing this other button over here?"
doctorremulac3, Dec 13 2022
  

       Unintended consequences of Covid/RSV/'flu 'tripledemic' and/or aging Boomer/SilentGen population: DinosaurGoo Inc. just lost the guy whose job it was to make sure this info never got out. He had been failing in recent years; solar panel and wind turbine tech slipped into the mainstream while he was napping after lunch.
Sgt Teacup, Dec 13 2022
  

       Sustainment seems the next big hurdle.   

       There's a huge caveat as well, in that the energy in / energy out only accounts for the net laser input and not the energy requirements to drive the lasers in totality.
RayfordSteele, Dec 13 2022
  

       Like a mutual fund that gives you 3% in 10 years when inflation's at 6%. You get more money back except that it's less.   

       I'll hold off tap dancing with joy over this breakthrough. Glad they're working on in but somebody's gonna have to show how they replaced fusion methods that we know work. Hydrogen bombs (using atom bombs) and the Sun, (using 1.989 x 10^30 kilograms of mass and the associated gravity induced pressure).   

       But hey, let's keep looking, just not holding my breath.
doctorremulac3, Dec 13 2022
  

       //what's causing the net gain?// I think it's a potent combination of mathematics (or perhaps just computation) and materials science.
pocmloc, Dec 13 2022
  

       // what's causing the net gain? //   

       From link   

       “Before we get to visions of fusion power plants dotting the landscape, however, there's the uncomfortable fact that producing the 2 megajoules of laser power that started the fusion reaction took about 300 megajoules of grid power, so the overall process is nowhere near the break-even point. So, while this was a real sign of progress in getting this form of fusion to work, we're still left with major questions about whether laser-driven fusion can be optimized enough to be useful. At least one DOE employee suggested that separating it from its nuclear-testing-focused roots may be needed to do so.”
a1, Dec 13 2022
  

       //what's causing the net gain?// I think it's a potent combination of mathematics (or perhaps just computation) and materials science//   

       ...and research funding salesmanship?
doctorremulac3, Dec 14 2022
  

       m'yeah... I'm going with hydrogen, but by all means dump your investment money into this if you'd like.   

       // I'm going with hydrogen, //   

       Got some in your pocket? Buried in a strongbox under the back porch?
a1, Dec 15 2022
  

       Someday I hope to passively electrolyze water pulled from ambient humidity and make my own hydrogen, but by all means invest your bitcoin in this endeavour.   

       // hope //   

       does not an engineering plan make.   

       // electrolyze water //   

       Takes a bit of energy. Guess how much.   

       // make my own hydrogen //   

       To keep in a strongbox under the back porch?
a1, Dec 16 2022
  

       //Guess how much//   

       [a1], you're forgetting energy arbitrage.   

       As I write this, the marginal economic cost of electrical energy in sunny Western Australia is pretty close to zero. In some scenarios, it might even be negative. Twelve hours from now, it will be a whole lot higher.   

       In less sunny climates, similar differences apply between high-wind and low-wind times.   

       If [2 Fries]' //strongbox under the back porch// can hold the hydrogen - or most of it - for those twelve hours, he may still be on to a winner.
pertinax, Dec 16 2022
  

       //Takes a bit of energy. Guess how much.
To keep in a strongbox under the back porch?//
  

       No idea how much energy needed yet.
Solar panels will run the dehumidifier, other solar panels will provide electrolysis, Even more solar panels will run compressors and the two gasses will be stored in twin tanks, with one tank kept at less than half the atmospheric pressure of the other, so that all oxygen will be displaced from the hydrogen canister rendering it non-flamable until recombined with oxygen.
  

       It will take some tweaking... but switching to hydrogen is just smart.
Hell, even burning corn liquor and refining hemp oil is smarter than what we're all doing now.
  

       We don't need gas and oil anymore and everybody knows it.   

       // you're forgetting energy arbitrage //   

       Not at all. I was just asking [2fries] if he knew how much energy he’d need for electrolysis. He says he doesn’t. But hey, one can always hope.
a1, Dec 16 2022
  

       If what I have read is correct then water can be split into hydrogen and oxygen without electricity at all. Adding power just speeds up the process.   

       // water can be split into hydrogen and oxygen without electricity at all... //   

       Yes, there are several approaches to water splitting (link). Are you hoping to implement an existing approach or hoping to discover something new?   

       // Adding power just speeds up the process //   

       Some kind of power is ALWAYS needed, we're just discussing what you're hoping to use. Keep in mind for ANY kind of reaction - if power comes OUT of a reaction at one end, pretty much the same amount had to go in at the other end. You may not need to provide that energy yourself - Sisyphus might have already rolled the stone uphill before you got there to kick it back down.   

       But if you can't figure out where the inputs and outputs are, you need to look closer. Most scientific progress is made when someone says "Where did THAT come from?"
a1, Dec 16 2022
  

       We still need oil to produce a fair amount of plastics. Not that we should or that we really need plastics, but hey, they're lightweight when it comes to transportation parts, and that's where we are.
RayfordSteele, Dec 17 2022
  

       //Yes, there are several approaches to water splitting. Are you hoping to implement an existing approach or hoping to discover something new?//   

       <shrugs>
These things seem to take on a life of their own once I get around to tackling them. I'll start with what's already known and go from there. If I manage to figure out something better than what we do now, well... it wouldn't be the first time.   
  

            

       //Some kind of power is ALWAYS needed, we're just discussing what you're hoping to use.//    

       "We're... or You're"?
Answering your question is hard. I have no choice but to concentrate only on priorities for the next couple of years, but there are several ways to passively produce power at my disposal. They just need harnessing.  
  

       //But if you can't figure out where the inputs and outputs are, you need to look closer. Most scientific progress is made when someone says "Where did THAT come from?"//   

       I've found that almost every original thought I've ever had came with the dumbfounded thought;
'I can't be the first schmuck to have thought of this'...
...and then find out otherwise.
  

       "If they'd only consulted me!" is like my motto.   

       ...   

       Seriously I should really be consulted more often.
Things would go more smoothly.
  

       //"If they'd only consulted me!" is like my motto.//   

       We waste a lot of problem solving potential by only having a small number of people presented with/understanding the problem to be solved. There's vast opportunity there.
bs0u0155, Dec 30 2022
  

       Can someone turn off 2 fries' horn that seems stuck on auto-toot? It's waking the neighborhood.
RayfordSteele, Dec 30 2022
  

       If we could simply increase the number of people //understanding the problem// then that alone would solve a lot of our problems.
pocmloc, Dec 30 2022
  

       //It's waking the neighbourhood//   

       Well, see now... if I'd just been consulted this all could have been avoided.   

         

       //We waste a lot of problem solving potential by only having a small number of people presented with/understanding the problem to be solved. There's vast opportunity there.//   

       Sure. Crowd-sourcing is great but I'm just one voice in a windstorm and people seem to desire credentials before taking advice from strangers.   

       My only credential is that I have no credentials.
Over half a century of flying by the seat of my pants and trusting my intuiton.
  

       Heh...   

       [Have Gut, Will Travel] reads the card of a man...   
      
[annotate]
  


 

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