h a l f b a k e r yBaker Street Irregulars
add, search, annotate, link, view, overview, recent, by name, random
news, help, about, links, report a problem
browse anonymously,
or get an account
and write.
register,
|
|
|
What would happen if a non-transitioned, straight, heterosexual couple, consisting of a masculine man and a feminine woman, falsely declared themselves to be finished products of the gender transitioning process, telling the trans community that they'd both completely and successfully switched genders,
and no-one could tell the difference between this couple and any regular non-transitioned, heterosexual couple?
Would they have any relevance, or garner any attention - if their ruse worked - in the so-called 'trans community'?
Would they be idolized as the pinnacle of flawless transitioning?
(Assuming a 100% successful gender transition means blending in seamlessly with those of your preferred gender, having normal heterosexual love-life, and not having even a hint left of your previous gender....
Or, would they simply be ignored along with the non-trans population?
And if the imposter couple were found out, would they be shunned by the all-inclusive trans community for fraudulent gender identity disclosure?
And how would this reflect on the trans community - would it help them realise how utterly ridiculous the whole concept of 'transitioning' really is?
.
Or is the gender agenda really just all about getting attention?
And if so, who's attention do they really want the most?
Clearly, they have captured some of mine, for whatever it's worth.
I sincerely hope I have offended someone, if not everyone.
The injecting bleach hoax came from Trump commenting on this:
https://www.cedars-...ted-with-uva-light/
[doctorremulac3, May 02 2024]
Trump telling you to inject bleach without actually using the word bleach.
https://www.youtube...share&v=zicGxU5MfwE
Clearly when he said light that was code for Clorox bleach. [doctorremulac3, May 02 2024]
"Injection" at :34
https://www.youtube...watch?v=33QdTOyXz3w
[4and20, May 02 2024]
Drinking bleach #1
https://www.statesm...onavirus/113754708/
[doctorremulac3, May 02 2024]
Drinking bleach #2
https://www.politif...bout-disinfectant-/
[doctorremulac3, May 02 2024]
Drinking bleach etc
https://www.newswee...-cure-covid-1619105
[doctorremulac3, May 02 2024]
Covid origins debate discussion overview
https://www.astralc...ok-review-rootclaim
Very long - but also interesting, if you like that sort of thing. [Loris, May 02 2024]
Other lab leak "conspiracy theories".
https://en.wikipedi...osecurity_incidents
Make sure your tinfoil hat's on straight before you click this one. [doctorremulac3, May 03 2024]
IMPRESSIVE!
https://www.halfbak...iv:dh=1:dn=100:ds=1
[a1, May 03 2024]
When the distractions aren't working anymore, time to call...
https://www.youtube...watch?v=KS26bVHCDD4
the Divertor! [doctorremulac3, May 05 2024]
"We will continue to be your single source of truth," and that, "Unless you hear it from us, (the government) it is not the truth."
https://www.snopes....cinda-ardern-truth/
[doctorremulac3, May 05 2024]
Wait... disregard everything I said, this is HUGE!
https://www.newswee...zona-europe-1897031
[doctorremulac3, May 05 2024]
HUUUUUUGE! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!!
https://penncapital...ecade-records-show/
[doctorremulac3, May 05 2024]
WAKE UUUUUUUUUUPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!
https://www.economi...5/04/capturing-ufos
(Yes, the multiple Ps would be pronounced by blowing a razzberry.) [doctorremulac3, May 05 2024]
You can take a holiday
https://www.goodrea...ow/26031368-goatman
take some time to get away [4and20, May 06 2024]
[link]
|
| |
While I completely agree with you I have to bone this for being a rant. |
|
| |
//if the imposter couple were found out// |
|
| |
But they can't be found out .. by the rules of the trans communities charter if you identify as a fully transformed ex-member of the gender you weren't assigned at birth then that's what you really are and no one is allowed to question it, and anyone that does must be instantly non-personed and expelled from the trans community .. them's the rules. |
|
| |
So you just outlined an impossible event on a par with Bolton Wanderers F.C winning the super bowl. |
|
| |
Unless they choose to self identify as a US American Football team and as having won the super bowl of course, then it's perfectly possible. |
|
| |
Um, I'm gonna need a new simile. |
|
| |
Gimme a minute here will you... |
|
| |
What [Voice] said. Not an invention, more an unoriginal rant than anything else. |
|
| |
No, it's not just a rant. It's a plausible idea, and one I'd like to fully bake sometime. I've had some experience with people from the trans community, and it seems the only thing worth mixing with them ever again for would be to beat them at their own game. |
|
| |
To my mind, the gender debacle is a serious regression (I didn't say recidivist - this ain't no rant) issue, and as with any regressive adults, the best remedy is a taste of their own medicine. |
|
| |
(The reason I say it's regressive, is that many children go through a genderless, or androgynous, phase when they are still growing up. But they usually have grown out of this fantasy by the time they hit puberty. ) |
|
| |
Let them see some real hormones in action, and smell some genuine, natural pheremones, and compete with that, instead of trying to prove themselves by joining sports teams and thumping the opposition, |
|
| |
If this sounds too ranty, go ask Bob why he's your aunty. |
|
| |
//It's a plausible idea, and one I'd like to fully bake// |
|
| |
I'm not really sure that we can really call deliberately taunting and mocking the intellectually challenged a legitimate experiment? .. not saying we shouldn't (in this case) but maybe admit it's for fun not science? ;) |
|
| |
Besides, it's fully baked already, plenty of people have self-identified for the express purpose of sticking two fingers up to the trans community and exposing its hypocrisy, that weight lifter who self identified as a woman to take the women's record away from the trans woman that took it away from real women and then self-identified as male again once he'd done that is just one example. |
|
| |
Yes, ok, I'll be a manmaidwooman and admit it - I enjoy it. |
|
| |
Not offended, just unimpressed. |
|
| |
Well, most sane, logical people might say the same, as the whole gender thing - whether you're for or against it - is unimpressive.
But I just thought I might have a little fun with it. |
|
| |
I would be impressed by a man who claims to be a woman who claims to be a lesbian, to have affairs with actual "lesbians". |
|
| |
// the only thing worth mixing with them ever again for would be to beat them at their own game// What does this mean? [Edie] Are going to advocate the use of convincing black face next to beat “them” at their own game? What “game" is that? Explain yourself, as this is close to being some of the most rabid comments I have come across in a long time here. Are you a barely concealed supporter of "him"? [who's name cannot be mentioned on the HB] Reveal yourself. |
|
| |
// Are you a barely concealed supporter of "him"? // |
|
| |
You may be confusing [Edie] with Catlyn Jenner. The only physical game women can beat Catlyn Jenner at. |
|
| |
I want to respond, [xenzag], but someone said that the politics have driven people away from here, so I won't. |
|
| |
The whole idea stinks of right wing extremism and intolerance. It's just a nasty indulgence which is then amplified by that "beat them at their own game" comment. The politics of hatred has no place here. [marked-for-deletion] |
|
| |
The whole idea stinks of right wing extremism and intolerance. It's just a nasty indulgence which is then amplified by that "beat them at their own game" comment. The politics of hatred has no place here. [marked-for-deletion] |
|
| |
fascist extremism often attracts its like in opposition [xen], not that I'm seeing it here mind .. I am seeing a pretty inappropriate 'idea' for this site .. but the nearest thing to an extremist ideologue larping as some vague sort of wannabe fascist that I'm really seeing right now & here is you, so maybe dial it back a notch. |
|
| |
After all, we all already know that your politics are all about imagining hatred and division where it isn't then projecting your own hatred at others, you don't need to tell us again. |
|
| |
I dunno if I'd use the same terminology as [xenzag], but this is still a rant targeting a specific group, and not even possible to frame it as an "invention." Offensive for the sake of being offensive. |
|
| |
As you say [Skewed], pretty inappropriate for this site. |
|
| |
I know [a1], what can I say [xen] brings out the worst in me, it often happens when I hear racists telling other people that they're the racist (ie BLM and DEI proponents, dyed in the wool literal provable racists every one of them) and with similar stuff .. maybe [xen] could try just not provoking me by dog whistling similar crap to that half the time he bothers to open his mouth ;p |
|
| |
But I do find it easier to give latitude to someone I generally agree with, even if I don't agree with their phrasing. Not just on this matter but generally - don't you find that to be true yourself? |
|
| |
Maybe [xen] just wound you up too many times. Hasn't hit the threshhold for me yet. |
|
| |
I make no apologies for my anti-fascist views. I'm also anti-moron so you [anyone who wears that hat] can take issue with that too if they want. |
|
| |
If "BLM proponents" are "provable racists every one of them", then are all of my goats pregnant because of Trumpsters? |
|
| |
There may be an element of historic annoyance going back a ways that colours the way I interpret his words and how I respond, some of it may even be undeserved, transferred from others or misattributed to him, and I've got a whole lot 'grumpier' in the last 10 years, delayed reaction to the circa 2016 swing as it began to bite and I got more annoyed at how the language was being butchered on the alter of trans 'acceptance' perhaps, or maybe it's just a result of getting older, what I find most annoying about it all is that real trans already had all the acceptance and every right the trans 'activists' and 'allies' claim to be fighting for all the way back in the 90s if not 80s, it's insulting as all hell to be told the history I actually lived didn't actually happen and to be expected to actually believe it under threat of sanctions legal and other that they often say that they want for anyone disagreeing with their fake version of history and reality, I am very done with letting it slide any more in any forum. |
|
| |
Being 'nice' to these (and other) people has just let it get worse. |
|
| |
No [xen] you're making no apology for your fascist views, tell the truth, I know you're incapable of course. |
|
| |
No [4and], I hear rumours that's the Welsh, they've had a shortage of sheep recently ;p |
|
| |
BLM are 'fierce' advocates of 'positive discrimination', DEI and critical race theory > those are all founded on and require adherence to and acceptance of racist ideologies and opinions > ergo they are advocating for racism > ergo they are racists .. it's not that hard to understand, it's also the cold hard truth. |
|
| |
In 8th's absence, obligatory ST:TOS reference: |
|
| |
Captain Kirk: It exists on the hate of others. |
|
| |
Mr. Spock: To put it simply. And it has acted as a catalyst, creating this situation in order to satisfy that need. |
|
| |
–In “Day of the Dove,” Star Trek (S3:E7) |
|
| |
Edie, Xen, Skewed - are you being played or are you the players? |
|
| |
Yes I suppose this was not only half-baked (maybe only a quarter baked even) but also inflammatory. Sorry. Perhaps swift deletion would be in order.
Besides all the other things proposed by this admittedly rather risky social experiment, in saying that I sincerely hoped I would offend, I was most wrong.
My apologies.
Sincerely. |
|
| |
//I would be impressed by a man who claims to be a woman who claims to be a lesbian, to have affairs with actual "lesbians".//[4and20]
Now that's the kind of thing I'm getting at.
Thanks for joining in the fun side of the discussion. |
|
| |
I could join in the fun side too but it might be taken as boasting about past escapades. There's a time and place for everything, and this ain't it for me. |
|
| |
It’s not what the halfbakery is about and I don’t care to engage in tiresome semantics with Qanon ranters who believe inter alia that Covid can be cured by drinking bleach; that vaccines contained alien DNA, or that there's no such thing as transgender being a really important issue for many people. I'm off for a break. |
|
| |
//Qanon ranters who believe inter alia that Covid can be cured by drinking bleach// |
|
| |
Show me the clip of anybody saying drink bleach to cure covid. If you're talking about the center of your universe, he was clearly referring to experiments in light treatment of the blood to combat infection, something that was and is being studied, the well known use of light therapy. (link) It's sciencey so don't bother reading it. Anyway, here's the actual quote your cult twisted into "drinking bleach" |
|
| |
"A question that probably some of you are thinking of if you’re totally into that world, which I find to be very interesting. So, supposedly we hit the body with a tremendous, whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light, and I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way. (To Bryan) And I think you said you’re going to test that, too. Sounds interesting, right?" |
|
| |
When your'e in a cult, you're basically living in a dream. |
|
| |
No, he suggested injecting bleach. |
|
| |
// When your'e in a cult, you're basically living in a dream // |
|
| |
No, he did not. Read his actual statement. |
|
| |
"A question that probably some of you are thinking of if you’re totally into that world, which I find to be very interesting. So, supposedly we hit the body with a tremendous, whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light, and I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way. (To Bryan) And I think you said you’re going to test that, too. Sounds interesting, right?" |
|
| |
// Read his actual statement // |
|
| |
I did. It's not that long. But you chose to leave that part out. I wonder why, coughacult. |
|
| |
He does not say bleach but disinfectant. Funny thing about the word "suggested". It's a much weaker form of "said". "I may have suggested Obama's wife is a tranny, but I never said it" |
|
| |
Don't change the subject cultie, since you can't read the transcript, watch the video. |
|
| |
Hate Trump all you want but how about not making shit up? |
|
| |
And again, this all has one purpose, to keep the citizens from discussing actual issues. I'm wasting my time with this, absolute garbage. |
|
| |
Meanwhile, how are we on national security? The military industrial complex's never ending war machine? Nuclear power being kept from the people because it doesn't make anybody rich? The idea that maybe gain of function research should be discussed? |
|
| |
Nope, Orangeman and bleach. |
|
| |
// There's a time and place for everything // |
|
| |
Is that place Las Vegas? You in a farm girl's cowslip and bowlcut armpits? |
|
| |
Don't speculate on what a relationship with a woman might be like, it's embarrassing. Stick with your cats. |
|
| |
The word you're looking for in the third paragraph is "passing". |
|
| |
Lots to offend in this one. I take issue with the use of "imposter" for example. And also sexual orientation has nothing to do with gender assignment. |
|
| |
You should take some time to educate yourself more on this topic, since you are quite interested in it. It would be good to come from a place of knowledge on the subject, I'm sure the resulting discussion would be much more interesting than this unfortunate post. |
|
| |
Furthermore I am certain that the scenario you describe in the initial paragraph has occurred many, many times, though not under false pretenses. |
|
| |
[doc], you apparently also work while you're posting on the HB, and I'm sorry for that, but it's not helping your ability to do the simplest searches, even to hear your guru queef. |
|
| |
Trump's the center of your "life", not mine. I've got one, you should look into it. |
|
| |
[Doc] You are a serial liar, like your guru. I don't spend 2% of your time here. Is that your proof that you have a life, bragging about your alleged one? |
|
| |
[doctor] you fall for it every time. |
|
| |
Actually, I'm glad you both think Trump said we should drink bleach to cure Covid. |
|
| |
Um.
Unlike the idea above, which I don't think is worth my time, I thought this Trump bleach thing was interesting enough to look into more carefully. |
|
| |
"A question that probably some of you are thinking of if you’re totally into that world, which I find to be very interesting. So, supposedly we hit the body with a tremendous, whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light, and I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way. (To Bryan) And I think you said you’re going to test that, too. Sounds interesting, right?" |
|
| |
So far so good. But then he starts talking about disinfectant.
I watched a video on youtube to check a transcript I found, then edited to follow on directly from the above. I tried to make it verbatim - although the punctuation may not match your interpretation precisely, I think that doesn't change anything. |
|
| |
"And I then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out, in a minute, one minute, and is there a way you can do something like that by injection inside, or or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs, and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it'd be interesting to check that. So you're going to have to use medical doctors, but it sounds interesting to me, so we'll see. But the whole concept of the light, the way it goes in one minute, that's pretty powerful." |
|
| |
And UV light is used for disinfection, so yes, if you look at the quote and stop before you go on too far it is arguably reasonable - albeit maybe potentially misleading. But then he uses the word "injection", which I would say is absolutely the wrong word for using light - even if the light source is internal.
So I think that's where the real problem lies. It looks very much like he's moving on to propose chemical disinfectant (n.b. the word 'bleach' isn't mentioned) as another alternative option.
|
|
| |
I do think he was /actually/ intending to stay on the concept of light as disinfectant and just used the wrong word (i.e. injection) as a slip-of-the-tongue.
I'd very much be inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt on this - except that he later gave a press conference saying that he was just being sarcastic. Which does suggest that he meant it as people interpreted it.
Which I think is actually his own ego shooting him in the foot. He didn't want to admit to any sort of error, so he said it was a joke instead. |
|
| |
Oh my god! Thank you Loris! (Who let this sane person in!?) |
|
| |
Thank you for restoring my faith in humanity. |
|
| |
Tat and 420, please don't stop believing that Trump said we need to drink bleach. Promise? |
|
| |
[doctor] I've never made such an assertion once, perhaps you have mistaken me for someone else. |
|
| |
Sorry Tat, misunderstanding. My apologies, disregard. |
|
| |
4and20, you need to stop lying about Trump not saying to drink bleach. He did say it, you're a serial liar to suggest anything else. |
|
| |
Careful now, doc - I don't give him a free pass - I think it still looks misleading, and he didn't do himself any favours. |
|
| |
But this thing where people pick on some arbitrary quote with some sort of minor gaffe and push it incessantly, it's super frustrating. |
|
| |
[Loris] I've tried quite hard to give your explanation the benefit of the doubt, but after watching what he said 3 or more times (while trying to find the best jump-to-time), he meant injecting disinfectant. Benefit-of-the-doubt wise, I didn't find it objectionable for him in any way -- now or then -- to spitball ideas, but he should have done it with the help of some experts. |
|
| |
Loris, absolutely, and I agree, communication counts, but look how this sort of media garbage and cult hive-mind crap keeps us from discussing actual issues. |
|
| |
So do we discuss the future of gain of function research and its possible dangers, maybe looking into regulations regarding such research or do we just talk about drinking bleach? |
|
| |
One side of the political spectrum has a very clear answer to that question. |
|
| |
And to be clear, even if this particular plague DIDN'T come from gain of function research, the blowback from this is that now we're not supposed to even talk about it. If there's a lab leak or a biowarfare incident in 10 years that kills fifty million people, what do we tell our grandkids we did about it? "Not my fault, I said Trump said to drink bleach." |
|
| |
I like to imagine all the idiot AI iterations which are collecting Doc's "wisdom" as nonsense text and regurgitating it to simpletons in eons hence. It would be worth satirizing if it didn't arrive pre-satirized. |
|
| |
Always let the asshole have the last word. |
|
| |
I think I move in different circles to you, doc. I'm not really aware of this suppression of talking about gain-of-function research. |
|
| |
I think I posted a link to a write up of people discussing it in great depth recently, didn't I? If I didn't, or you missed it, give me a nudge and I'll post it again. |
|
| |
I looked at the covid origins thing in some depth and wrote up my evaluation on the HB in one of the long discussions. I think it's been deleted, most annoying.
To sum up, though, I thought the balance of probability was strongly towards a 'natural' outbreak. |
|
| |
In terms of whether scientists should be allowed to do things, I'm in favour of it not being legal to generate new potential pathogens, or make existing pathogens worse.
Seems like a no-brainer, and I believe that to be the case already, most places. |
|
| |
I'm not in favour of banning all "gain-of-function" experiments, because that's an overly broad ban. Like wanting to ban monster-trucks, and instead writing a law which bans all wheels and things which spin - including but not limited to wheels on normal cars, bicycles, shopping trolleys, those little things in sliding drawers, that thing on your mouse, washing machines, most motors (in things like hair-driers), electric turbines, locks, etc. |
|
| |
Well there you go, this is a complicated subject worth discussing. And to be clear, I very much do NOT have all the answers to deal with this, that's what discussion and looking into and sharing possibilities is for. |
|
| |
But yes, please repost, I'd like to read it. |
|
| |
Link posted. (warning - that site may make your browser struggle to open the tab for a moment.) |
|
| |
Because of the format, there's a little bit of chaff to deal with. But it does also mean it covers a lot of ground. |
|
| |
My favourite bit:
:: Rumor said that [part of the wet-market] included a stall with raccoon-dogs, an animal which is generally teeming with weird coronaviruses, and is a plausible intermediate host between humans and bats
China said this rumor was false and refused to release any information. Scientists were finally able to confirm the existence of the raccoon-dog shop in the funniest possible way: a virologist had visited Wuhan in 2014, saw the awful conditions in the shop, and took a picture as an example of the kind of place that a future pandemic might start.:: |
|
| |
There's also a later article with more discussion of the discussion, if this isn't enough for you (but it probably is). |
|
| |
Cool, I'll check it out, thank you Loris. |
|
| |
By the way, my cousin is CEO of a very successful vaccine company he started and he was my go to guy discussing this. I know what I don't know and love going to people who are actually in the trenches to find out what's what. |
|
| |
The more I learn the more I realize how little I know. |
|
| |
Right! Thanks, [doctor], I have my mission:
To the Trans trenches! |
|
| |
// Always let the asshole have the last word.// |
|
| |
// sexual orientation has nothing to do with gender assignment. // |
|
| |
//all founded on and require adherence to and acceptance of racist ideologies and opinions > ergo they are advocating for racism // |
|
| |
No they all aren't. Most "religious" people have never read religious texts, neither have most atheists. Most doctors never study nutrition. Odd as it seems, people can act with a moral compunction which has nothing to do with ideology. |
|
| |
// I'm in favour of it not being legal to generate new potential pathogens, or make existing pathogens worse.// |
|
| |
In my nonscientific conjecture, I don't know how scientists anticipate newer, even worse versions of a virus, fast as viruses mutate, without making some nasty bits themselves. |
|
| |
Please stay on the subject at hand! This has become an argument, not a debate/discussion/interesting commentary. I am willing to accept some of the blame for that, because I realise my idea was only quarter-baked and inflammatory, but try to keep it light, or this idea will end up being a soggy under baked mess and get deleted. Which may be a good thing, so.... |
|
| |
//In my nonscientific conjecture, I don't know how scientists anticipate newer, even worse versions of a virus, fast as viruses mutate, without making some nasty bits themselves.// |
|
| |
The idea of making something in order to figure out how to deal with is certainly the argument for. |
|
| |
However, a large fraction of biology (and science in general) involves working with a proxy (a stand-in replacement) for the thing you're working on.
It may not be as straightforward, but that's how it's done in general. |
|
| |
Without being an expert in the specific field, and off the top of my head: |
|
| |
Working with the unmodified pathogenic organism is presumably going to have to happen (If nothing else, diseases need to be diagnosed and treated). Research on this is as dangerous as it ever was, and there are safeguards for that in place in all sensible jurisdictions. |
|
| |
If you are for example worried about a specific mutation happening and what it could mean, work with model systems. This includes various things which I think people already do:
- Looking at other related pathogens to see what they are, and how they behave.
- Computer modelling. I think what this even is, is often misunderstood. It's very much not a simple replacement for every biological process one may want to test. But e.g. modelling of proteins, and interactions between proteins is coming on, and may be useful if you have a good idea of what you're looking for.
- Creating the specific altered products in a safe manner, and then looking at how they behave /in vitro/. For example, one can produce protein(s) in a safe way by taking the gene from the pathogen and putting it in something unrelated, in a manner which definitely won't have a risk of escape. Once you have this system, you can make the modifications you are interested in and look at the difference.
You can describe this as a gain of function experiment, but it's a gain of function of a component, not the organism.
An (imperfect) analogy might be that if you were worried about a particular car modification being potentially dangerous (e.g. "I think this replacement fuel tank could make the entire vehicle explode"), you wouldn't make the change to a working car and go out driving in it (even on a private road). You'd take just the parts you were changing and the bits it interacted with, set up a test rig to see what happened.
|
|
| |
It's a fair answer, but last I heard basic protein folding could not be modelled, even after farming calculations out to the WWW. |
|
| |
Protein folding algorithms have I think really been coming on in the last few years - but that's not actually necessary if you have good structural data.
So you get protein structures for whatever proteins/complexes you're interested in with the native protein, then you substitute in the modifications, get a new structure and run your simulations with that. |
|
| |
The sticking point here is that getting protein structures is often really difficult. It's not my expertise; it uses techniques I don't really understand like X-ray crystallography. But biochemists were doing it already before computer modelling was even really a thing, for the insights it could give. |
|
| |
My Transfoolery Experiment has gone awry....looks like I've been fooled into reading a lot of bumph online about science, which is not my strong point, instead of gadding about with transients to learn more about them. Dern. Suppose I should get out more. |
|
| |
If we gotta create monster XYZ to be able to fight monster XYZ in case somebody should create monster XYZ, maybe at least put the facility on an island where before you leave you go to an adjacent quarantine island for a month or so. |
|
| |
Doesn't have to be unpleasant. Could have beaches, pools, basically make it a resort, but don't be having poorly trained idiots engaging in horrible safety protocols getting infected then going to a wet market down the street where thousands of people are crammed together face to face. |
|
| |
Then monitor the shit out of this island fully understanding you're playing with mass genocide here. Nothing gets shipped in or out without stringent security measures. In fact, the only thing that should be allowed to leave is carefully searched people after quarantine The flag should be a flaming skull as a reminder. |
|
| |
The main island doesn't really even have to be manned, couldn't think of a better use of remote controlled robots and automated machines. |
|
| |
But whatever the approach, the current one, "Nothing to see here, everything's fine, OHH LOOK! HE SAID DRINK BLEACH!" is a recipe for disaster. |
|
| |
The idea posted is mean spirited & asinine, which is an extremely difficult combination to pull off. The quadruple axel of halfbakery shitposting. |
|
| |
//mean spirited & asinine, which is an extremely difficult combination to pull off//
Hah! Even a donkey can pull that off. Heehaw! |
|
| |
Here's an idea, if everyone stopped taking notice of right-wing talking points, we would all be much better off. |
|
| |
For example, nobody would be talking about:
Transgender "Ideology" - largely promoted and puffed up by the right- it's only ever talked about by right-wing client media outlets, and the people who consume them
Covid-as-conspiracy - entirely chaff invented to run interference
Wokeness - another simple thing blown out of all proportion.
BLM, CRT and schools teaching multiple genders - relatively small stories stretched out of all recognition and amplified to the point where people get angry at shadows caused by (often cynically and deliberately) misreporting of the facts
Cancelling "Christmas" - another trope that gets wheeled out every year
And all the other right-wing tropes that generate so much meaningless and often harmful noise. |
|
| |
It'll all be extra loud this year because of the elections, clearly there are a number of people here who continue to be sucked in. To those, I say, You do not have to be a sucker. Live your lives, and stop listening to right-wing talking points! The world is a beautiful place, full of (mostly) lovely people, all working together (for the most part) to generally get along. There is no woke-"agenda", most of the human population has developed immunity to Covid now, so that's pretty much not an issue anymore. |
|
| |
The biggest and worst thing to worry about is the creeping authoritarianism that all this right-wing fear and loathing peddling has generated - and that *does* affect us all in very serious and meaningful ways. It's sad that we're where we are in some respects, and all because a great many people believed the fear mongering. Can we all agree to be a bit more critical about who's raising these nonsense talking points, and then paying millions to get Fox and other right-wing media outlets to repeatedly spout the same zero-opinions over and over again? Clearly it's a well organised, well funded affair, it's a shame so many people are so ready to dance to that tune. |
|
| |
If you do lean to the right, politically - great - there is nothing wrong with that at all. But what seems to have happened in the last 10 years or so is that the right have discovered shameless privately-funded propaganda and have gone all in. |
|
| |
Yes, there are some vestiges of the old Conservatism, but they've largely been booted out of their respective American or British parties by this new type of fantasy-inventing privately funded propagandists. It would be fantastic, for everyone if that old-school Conservatism, shed itself of the corrupting nature of making shit up, and went back to proposing proper solutions to actual, real problems. |
|
| |
Instead it's all fear, and woke, and transvestites going to the toilet, and gender, and fluff that nobody except the right-wing-media machine keep ballooning into the public sphere. Stop it! |
|
| |
Yes, there are also people on the left who get fired up by these same stories, but if you look carefully, they only get reported by RWM, largely to help fluff up the stories more. Without that amplification, nobody would know what someone in Portland has decided to feel about their self-identity today. |
|
| |
The problem is [zen] that not all of the things you listed really are just //right wing talking points// that wouldn't be a thing if the right didn't talk about them, some of them are very real and you can't pretend all that you mention are just //talking points//, to do so is a lie, you are lying to me [zen], and expecting (or at least demanding) that I pretend you are not, that annoys me, and is (deliberately I suspect) deeply insulting .. there can be little space for an honest conversation if you are going to start with a flat out lie. |
|
| |
So let me return a pair of your words to you //Stop it!// |
|
| |
If I've said something you don't agree with, then please help me understand your point of view. |
|
| |
I've got no reason to bother trying to deceive anyone, and to be honest, I don't really understand why you'd imagine that would be a position I would take. |
|
| |
Still, each to their own. You do you. |
|
| |
Postmodernist interpreters exalted ideology as the driving force in a posttruth world, pulling indifferent university students along with them. In a world without absolute truths, it's apparently only power which differentiates ideologies in their minds. But they seem to believe that few people act without (centralized) ideology. I suspect its true origins, like the origins of Marxism, lie somewhere in German Idealism. |
|
| |
"There is one thing that is absolutely certain about throwing a dead cat on the dining room table – and I don’t mean that people will be outraged, alarmed, disgusted. That is true, but irrelevant. The key point, says my Australian friend, is that everyone will shout, ‘Jeez, mate, there’s a dead cat on the table!’ In other words, they will be talking about the dead cat – the thing you want them to talk about – and they will not be talking about the issue that has been causing you so much grief." - Boris Johnson 2013 |
|
| |
“The real opposition is the media. And the way to deal with them is to flood the zone with shit.” - Steve Bannon 2018 |
|
| |
"Fox News agreed Tuesday to pay Dominion Voting Systems nearly $800 million to avert a trial in the voting machine company’s lawsuit that would have exposed how the network promoted lies about the 2020 presidential election." - Associated Press April 29 2023 |
|
| |
I personally find it beneficial to side with the side whose main rallying media bullhorn hasn't recently and not infrequently been sued into near-oblivion for spreading lies about people. |
|
| |
Covid-as-conspiracy - I'm personally of the opinion that the mechanisms to take advantage of the crisis were already in place, and anything would do. I also believe the virus leaked from a lab. In any case all of the western media pushed hard against anyone making any claim aside from "it's natural and this reaction to it is rational and proportional". Laws were passed persecuting people for saying these things. There was literally a new category of "bad" information enforced by big tech companies, that being people who were honestly reporting symptoms from the shots. Symptoms that really happened and were well proven but the discussion was suppressed. I'm sure They had a good reason to suppress it, that being to keep people from being afraid of the "vaccine". But the information was suppressed to the point that the average person who just believes what he's told still believes whatever was pushed about it. Lies were told and now I'm supposed to pretend that isn't the case. And I can't even say anything about this say, at work, for fear of being fired. This is 1984 levels of suppression.
Wokeness - another simple thing blown out of all proportion. It's not simple and it's not blown out of proportion. Persecution against a particular race and sex is evil and that's what woke does.It also persecutes anyone so abused who complains about it. You don't get to punish white men for the sins of their fathers, and you also don't get to invent new sins, lie about history, lie about individual men to get them replaced by women, minimize the plight of abused men, or perform any of the other wokist sins.
Well I'm out of time so I'll stop here. My point is your worldview is skewed from reality. |
|
| |
I agree with 4and20. The capricious allegory of the bourgeois anomaly is mellifluous with ambivalent cacophony, however the superfluous acrimony that fastidiously acquiesces to axiomatic cajoling elucidates the perspicacious conundrum. |
|
| |
That being said, as far as calmly discussing rational protective measures against future pandemics without it becoming nothing but a bunch of tribal shitslinging, I think we're fucked. |
|
| |
AI Marxism as picked up from Doc would still get a pass from neoMarxist professors. |
|
| |
I have no idea what that means, but like I said, rational discussion of issues we have to deal with in the age of mindless, foaming at the mouth tribal hatemongering? Not gonna happen. |
|
| |
//My point is your worldview is skewed from reality.// Appreciate your honesty [Voice] but your outline of the effects you've felt from "Wokeism", I just don't share. I'm white, but don't feel persecuted. There are standards and expectations around what is appropriate to talk about at work, and they're different to the standards and expectations around what is appropriate to talk about at the pub, or at home in the kitchen with the wife. I suspect that's not a new situation. I can only say that I've not noticed being punished, lied about or persecuted, and totally accept that maybe you feel you have. Few among my normal-sized network of friends and family, both in the UK and across the world (ok, well Canada and the US) seem to feel that way either. |
|
| |
So it is a surprise to me to be presented with the idea that my perspective is skewed in some way. I don't tend to consume right-wing media (i.e. I'm not on social media, and don't watch American cable news) could that be the difference between how you feel, and an alternate world view? |
|
| |
There are some people in my human network who do express some of the feelings you share, but interestingly, most of the terminology they use comes direct from these kinds of right-wing talking points, it's a shared, common language, despite them not necessarily knowing one another, they do seem to be most notably aggrieved at the same time - which is what you might expect if there were a media-based cause, rather than one experienced directly. |
|
| |
I'd imagine that if there were a real "woke" agenda, i.e. one that was actually impacting real people's lives, they might experience it first-hand, or in nuanced and different ways, but it doesn't seem to work like that. It's more about feelings (like the ones you've shared) of a kind of creeping, second-hand, inherited fear. |
|
| |
It's rarely anything that anyone's actually directly experienced. |
|
| |
Good luck convincing anyone "actually directly experiencing" fear that it isn't real. |
|
| |
I haven't visited a "western" country in a very long time, and some of the places I've been lately have been objectively if not subjectively frightening, but I can still recall the bland, condescending stonewalling you get in some western countries, almost regardless of how and why policies may have shifted. Call it "the hive mind" or some kind of "ism", but German-style social comformity underlies it all. |
|
| |
//no-one could tell the difference between this couple and any regular non-transitioned, heterosexual couple// |
|
| |
True story: in the 1990s, I asked my grandmother [Nan], born in 1920, if she knew of any gay or transgender people in her small town eastern Ontario farming communities during her childhood and as an adult on the farm. She had a very interesting, not at all excited view. She said that folks just took people as they presented themselves. |
|
| |
She cited the fact that everyone knew someone who had had a gay bull, a goat that refused to mate and ran away, or a chicken who took care of the 'girls' as would a rooster. |
|
| |
If a person wearing overalls, a plaid shirt and work boots asked a question about farm machinery at the general store or the co-op, the people gathered there answered. No one asked or worried about if the genitals under the clothes matched the presenting gender. |
|
| |
Nan figured there were probably same-sex or transgender people living as 'man and wife', and also figured the 'bachelor brothers' or 'maiden aunts' were probably gay, come to think of it. |
|
| |
There was more community approbation if the folks refused to attend church, or failed to support the local school or doctor. |
|
| |
// mean spirited & asinine, which is an extremely difficult combination to pull off// -calum
// Hah! Even a donkey can pull that off. Heehaw! // -Edie |
|
| |
Maybe, but still impressive for a relative newcomer. Edie, you have the distcintion (for now*) of posting two ideas that have 8 or more bones without any offsetting buns. There are a few others who have managed that**, but they've all had much longer careers. |
|
| |
Your mother must be very proud. |
|
| |
* vote tallies can change at any moment and may be outdated by the time you read this. |
|
| |
** Amishman35 (3), JesusHChrist (3), madness (3), Vernon (3), amuse (2), Archbishop Furball (2), daddyvortex (2), Edie (2), el dueno (2), novaris (2), outbroker (2), rcornell (2), sukiyaki (2), Voice (2). |
|
| |
//impressive for a relative newcomer// |
|
| |
It is rather isn't it, some who have previously tried for as many bones as possible have failed to achieve such noteworthy scores, which shows talent, and potentially a better grasp of the peccadillos of this audience and its constituent parts than many a veteran of this worthy site, further study may be of value to those desirous of similar achievements, an algorithm of dubious utility and use may conceivably be derived from such research, I propose we immediately form a focus group to look into the matter ;) |
|
| |
[manfully resists the urge to pop a bun on to blemish this pristine score just for the hell of it] |
|
| |
Hmmm. I seriously need to apply myself to upping my bun tally. This is starting to look somewhat unbalanced.
And all those fishbones might start attracting feral cats.
Back to the drawing board. |
|
| |
This doesn't encourage me to spend more time on this site than I have recently. Then again, I'm probably not missed if this is the kind of attitude people adopt on here. However, since I never bone ideas on principle, none of the negative votes on here are mine. Have a nice life. |
|
| |
I won't be engaging otherwise. |
|
| |
Wonder if it's time to have some kind of peace accords here. Lots of unhappy bakers, a fraction of the membership of bygone days, I know I basically use this place as a notepad since I've been jotting down ideas for over two decades now and it's great for that. |
|
| |
But friendly interactions like I used to have with Max and 8th are sadly pretty rare here. And we had disagreements on stuff so it wasn't that we were perfectly aligned, it was just enjoyable and interesting. |
|
| |
And let's not blame the new guy for this, it's been going on for a long time now. |
|
| |
Might just be a symptom of the bifurcation happening with all society these days which is by no means an un-natural event. Sociogenic mitosis is a fact of life. |
|
| |
Perhaps a symptom of the middle and working classes being squeezed? (so, the transfer of wealth?) large chunks of people with the perception they've got it worse than their parents often leads to unrest which can find various expressions not always clearly connected. |
|
| |
[Skewed] makes a great point. Poor white people and poor ethnic minorities can compete for the scraps while a few transgender activists get all the press. Some people imply that the division is deliberate, but honestly, how long would it take for the majority of people to insist on better focus, if they even knew how? |
|
| |
// seriously need to apply myself to upping my bun tally // |
|
| |
Sure, if that's what you want overall. But as you said you hoped to offend people with this idea, you should count these fishbones as a win. |
|
| |
I look forward to seeing what you can do across the whole range of good ideas as well as stinkers. |
|
| |
The people: "Shit! We're fucking slaves to the military industrial complex oligarchy and globalist one ruling party perpetual war agenda! We'll own nothing and be happy... or else? Fuck that!" |
|
| |
Military industrial complex oligarchy and globalist one party dictatorship: "You need sex clowns in your preschools - now fight it over proles, leave the ownership and control of everything to us." (That should keep them distracted) |
|
| |
"Uh oh, they're starting to catch on! Time to call... The Divertor!" (Link) |
|
| |
Please note, that video predicted this exactly. Beyond prescient, kind of spooky. |
|
| |
//Military industrial complex oligarchy and globalist one party dictatorship: "You need sex clowns// |
|
| |
You may be attributing a touch (just a touch, I don't say entirely) too much intelligent design to observed phenomena here, perhaps the same sort of 'magical thinking' in some ways that led to a belief in gods. |
|
| |
Socio economic phenomena are rarely so easily susceptible to deliberate manipulation and guidance (in the fashion you appear to be suggesting?) accept in the most superficial of ways, it's too big to control well and the motives of those that can have any small impact are more often driven by petty personal concerns (like staying in post for just one more term) rather than any grand Machiavellian schemes. |
|
| |
Not to mention any with the wherewithal to attempt to 'steer' are pretty often blind, shortsighted or looking in the wrong direction and all puling against each other so largely cancel each other out. |
|
| |
I guess I'm just taking the long way around to say "never attribute to malice .. " ;) |
|
| |
I hear what you're saying and it's important when evaluating directions and ideologies of certain groups to not apply too much import to the idea that there's one central Wizard Of Oz character behind it all, groups are typically too chaotic to attribute what they're doing to a perfectly aligned program. |
|
| |
But groups DO work towards specific goals. There may not be one hive mind master driving everything, but that doesn't mean that there's NO movement in a particular direction steered by people wanting something to happen or at least letting it happen. |
|
| |
So there doesn't need to necessarily be a grand, well coordinated scheme behind a movement, but movement DO happen. Stalin's Russia, Mao's China, Hitler's Germany. And to think we're immune to this sort of thing is a recipe for it actually happening. |
|
| |
There is a movement towards a one world fascist government. Doesn't need any one particular person or group behind it, it just needs believers. It's not a tinfoil hat conspiracy theory. Too many links to put up but I'll throw up one. |
|
| |
New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern once said, "We will continue to be your single source of truth," and that, "Unless you hear it from us, it is not the truth." |
|
| |
The "debunking" site I posted proposes that this is out of context, and it was fine for her to say this because it was regarding Covid, but it leaves out the fact that these government "facts" have since been proven to be, if not outright falsehoods, debatable evaluations of the situation at best. |
|
| |
Wait... what's that! UFOs!!! For real this time!!! |
|
| |
See the links!!! Hurry!!!! |
|
| |
The biggest influence toward America becoming a fascist nation is the unified authoritarian left and authoritarian right which do the same evil things using opposing malarkey to justify it. |
|
| |
Yup. The classic left vs right dichotomy has been hijacked and is now a control op. There's the people and there's the uniparty, and if you're the people, unless you unquestioningly do what you're told, you're despised by your globalist overlords. |
|
| |
But don't worry, they hate you just as much when you do what you're told so nothing to stress abou.... OH MY GOD! FLYING SAUCERS SHOOTING RIGHT WING ANTI ABORTION ENFORCED NON-VOLUNTARY TRANS SURGERY RAYS! RUN AWAAAAAAYY! |
|
| |
I have nothing to say, and I'm saying it. |
|
| |
A bit late for that, unfortunately. Since this idea is already causing some of our transbakers to want to leave this place perhaps you should just buckle down and delete the damn thing. |
|
| |
Dunno, say what you will about the idea, but some pretty interesting conversations have popped up here. |
|
| |
One way to look at things you disagree with or find offensive on a forum like this is to put up your counter views and have both be preserved for people to see. That's gonna do more to counter the idea you don't like than just censoring the original message. |
|
| |
I think debate is good and free speech is essential to a free people. Don't like what they said? Say your piece. Say it loud and clear and leave both positions up for people to make up their own minds. |
|
| |
Free speech is the cornerstone of a free society. You might personally be a great person who censors all the right stuff, but future generations that inherit this protocol might not be so virtuous. You'll just get pure fascism with a handful of people deciding what the masses get to hear. |
|
| |
Don't like something? Say it. Say why. Argue, debate, disagree. But don't censor it, because you're essentially just censoring both positions on the issue, yours included. |
|
| |
Well said, doc! But if it's not an invention, maybe you or Edie could take this to take this to your Facebook page. Or reddit, or "just about anywhere else on the internet," as [jutta] once said? |
|
| |
Given so many places online where anyone can discuss anything at all - can you explain why you, [2 fries] and a few others prefer to use HB for discussion of things that aren't inventions? |
|
| |
For the umpteenth time, this is an invention, it's a proposal for an experiment, like it or not. Those are ideas. |
|
| |
And there is no rule saying you can't discuss different topics, even unrelated to the original posted invention. |
|
| |
If ever that day ever came, (and I don't believe it would) I'm gone, along with the last handful of members of the once thriving and vibrant HB family. But again, that's not gonna happen, this website has been a bastion of free exchange of idea for decades, don't see that going anywhere, despite some people wanting it to. |
|
| |
As far as wanting something taken down because it causes booboo feelings, "I'm offended" is about as salient a debate point as saying your butt itches. |
|
| |
"But Doc, you get really pissed when somebody says something slanderous against your country." |
|
| |
Exactly, and I strike back, but NEVER have I asked that the statement be taken down. In fact I would insist that it NOT be taken down as long as my response isn't erased because the other person can't win the debate fair and square. (Ah-hmm) I'm not afraid of debate or afraid of those who are. |
|
| |
We've got a civilization to run here and it's complicated and challenging, we damn well better be able to talk about it. |
|
| |
Well said, doc! But if it's not an invention, maybe you or Edie could take this to take this to your Facebook page. Or reddit, or "just about anywhere else on the internet," as [jutta] once said? |
|
| |
Or - can you explain why you, [2 fries] and a few others prefer to use HB for discussion of things that aren't inventions? |
|
| |
Can you explain why you're so obsessed with silencing people? |
|
| |
I'm not going to argue about why a turd is a turd. And I don't think we should keep the turd on display for people who want to polish it. |
|
| |
This hateful idea has driven away at least one that we know -- and likely several that we don't -- transbakers whom are valuable members of this group. And more to come, I'm certain. So why are you in favor of that? |
|
| |
I reiterate, it's not really an invention. It's a rant in a very thing disguise and I wouldn't cry if you took it down. That said if someone is going to leave because they don't like the voicing of a political opinion with which they disagree, well they were going to leave sooner or later anyway. "safe spaces" are only a way to make weak people weaker. |
|
| |
My god! Voice, you're gonna make me cry that was so beautiful! * |
|
| |
//transbakers whom are valuable members of this group.// |
|
| |
My message to any "transbakers": Stay and fight. You're strong, so stand up. When somebody thinks you're too weak to say your piece, show them that they're wrong. |
|
| |
Say: "Tat, I am not a snowflake, I am perfectly capable of defending my views, my people and myself." |
|
| |
// Can you explain why you're so obsessed with silencing people? // |
|
| |
No interest in "silencing" anyone, not even you. Just prefer to see ideas for inventions here on HB. I think most who visit HB come for the inventions, not politics. And many left when they found too little of the former and too much of the latter. |
|
| |
If you think that's just my opinion, check other negative commenters on this topic. Or the helpfile. Paraphrasesd - The halfbakery is a communal database of poorly thought-out ideas for inventions. Users can post their inventions and add links and commentary to others.' "Advocacy" - promoting or protesting some issue - doesn't belong here unless you're inventing a new means to deal with the issue. |
|
| |
Would you say [jutta] has an interest in silencing people? Or is it just some special feeling (dare I say, :"obsession?") you have for me? |
|
| |
//I think most who visit HB come for the inventions, not politics.// |
|
| |
Oh my god, you did not just say that. A card carrying member of the “Trump is the center of the universe” club. |
|
| |
You must have me confused with someone else. |
|
| |
The neverending blathering on in these "debates" is what makes me want to go as well. |
|
| |
I come here to learn and be entertained by some creative and witty ideas that make me think and have some fun in doing so. |
|
| |
It used to be that when people got annoyed or insulted by behaviors that didn't fit the expectations and rules of an established community, those proceeding with such behaviors would change them. That's how it used to work. Now people, myself included, are more than pleased to ruffle feathers and feel justified in doing so like it's their mission or prerogative to upend any order they come across, and that continued attitude will eventually drive everyone but the truly thick-skinned away. |
|
| |
I'm tired of "debates about freedom" destroying what once was a place where creativity reigned freely. It used to be that nobody objected when the trolls who trod over the few rules we had were tossed on their heads. |
|
| |
So it's all those "debates about freedom" destroying the HB, not insults like calling somebody's opinions "never-ending blathering", got it. |
|
| |
And you want people "tossed on their heads". |
|
| |
Your vision for the HB sounds like a real fun place. |
|
| |
It was quite pleasant, thanks. People did things other than argue. And there were many more of them than now. |
|
| |
I'm Brian and so's my wife |
|
| |
That's a Monty Python line from the movie The Life of Brian, by the way, not some weird personal disclosure of my own. LOL
In the scene in question, Brian (the main character) is about to be crucified along with several other men - and their wives.
The centurion says "Brian may be released from crucifixion! Which one of you is Brian?"
One of the other men on a cross calls out from near the back of the field full of crosses, "I'm Brian and so's my wife!". |
|
| |
"Yes, we're all different." |
|
| |